Prize time :O
- Thread starter KingNosser
- Start date
KingNosser
Active member
yeah seen a whole bunch of models converted came across a good YT channel about just these devices but he's in the US and shipping etc but was helpful tips, just so far narrowed it down to that type rather than any exact model.
Still at least i was on the right track on what i needed, just a matter of picking one up and going through all the hassle with it, totally new item to me, least in the modern era.
It's all these darn games wanting 100GB a pop so often lol
Still at least i was on the right track on what i needed, just a matter of picking one up and going through all the hassle with it, totally new item to me, least in the modern era.
It's all these darn games wanting 100GB a pop so often lol
AlienALX
Well-known member
TBH you shouldn't need to put it in IT mode if you are using Win 11. It's only something you need to do if you want to use it with something that only likes ZFS. Which is mostly freenas, truenas and other ZFS based stuff.
In Windows you can just use JBOD or RAID modes.
Whilst I've been told a bunch of cards work in JBOD mode with the nas stuff (like the Adaptec cards) they absolutely don't.
In Windows you can just use JBOD or RAID modes.
Whilst I've been told a bunch of cards work in JBOD mode with the nas stuff (like the Adaptec cards) they absolutely don't.
KingNosser
Active member
Yea I just figure it might be the easiest option as others have done the leg work, it's mainly for game storage i have a hella lot of games 
Still in a month or so i expect before i set on my way to more storage i have some space atm, it's more ssd space i'll want first, but many games coming this year that i want that will use it, benifit of space is moving things around easier for loading speed tbh.
The case is dam heavy already but once filled i'll not be able to lift it, good thing it's staying where it is
I'm more concerned about not having issues with any card i buy than anything else as nothing is certain with some things, plus i've never used one so i don't know the issues i might face more than anything.
Still in a month or so i expect before i set on my way to more storage i have some space atm, it's more ssd space i'll want first, but many games coming this year that i want that will use it, benifit of space is moving things around easier for loading speed tbh.
The case is dam heavy already but once filled i'll not be able to lift it, good thing it's staying where it is
I'm more concerned about not having issues with any card i buy than anything else as nothing is certain with some things, plus i've never used one so i don't know the issues i might face more than anything.
From my experience, I tried a 9201-8i (9211-8i) in Windows 10 without flashing the IT Mode Firmware on to it and it wouldn't work, I then pulled the 2nd card which has the IT Mode Firmware and that worked without issue.
Flashed the first card and it worked in Windows 10 and is still sat running quite happily with a couple of drives on it.
If you do decide on one, then use the drives as "Separate" drives rather than using the “Windows Storage Space” feature as the write speeds to a drive created using it are from my experience incredibly slow.
I have one created with 2x Seagate 6TB, 2x WD Red 3TB, 1x Seagate 4TB drive, each drive can be written to individually at around 200Mbp/s but in the Windows Storage Space Drive the max write speed I have seen was 15Mbp/s.
You will need to be careful as Alien says to make sure you get a SATA 6Gb card, which means you want something that will work with SAS-2 drives, but if you can find a decently priced SAS-3 HBA then you will have no issues, just avoid the ones from China as typically they are Broadcom SOC’s which are legit LSI SOC’s but put on to “Home Made Fake” PCB’s.
The Art Of Server on YouTube does some good videos about this stuff I have found and even sells the cards, but they are more expensive that you would pay for one than you would pay for one from a Chinese seller.
I made the mistake of buying a “LSI 9201-16I” from a Chinese Seller and well let’s just say it’s working but I will be replacing it as soon as I have the £400 for a “9305-16I” for my Supermicro Chassis.
If you buy a SAS-2 card it will probably have SFF-8087 connectors so you can buy if they are not included SFF-8087 to 4 Sata breakout cables, and if you get a SAS-3 card then iirc you can also get some SFF-8643 to 4 Sata breakout cables.
Stay away from SAS Drives unless you want to get into the whole “Changing Sector Size” from 520 to 512 so they work with Windows.
Then just make sure you have good airflow over the card because they can get very hot, all of mine have 40mm Noctua fans on them, but the “9201-16I” will be having a 80mm Noctua fan put on it at some point.
The thing is though, you can also get M.2/NVME to SATA splitters if they will work in your motherboard to add more storage without the need for a HBA and whilst it might not be as clean, it may save you some cash if you only need a couple of drives.
You could always look at some large capacity SSD’s in a Mirror Raid setup as most motherboards will support that without needing additional hardware.
I would be surprised if you have more than 1TB of storage space used for games unless you just never uninstall them [FONT="]
[/FONT]
Flashed the first card and it worked in Windows 10 and is still sat running quite happily with a couple of drives on it.
If you do decide on one, then use the drives as "Separate" drives rather than using the “Windows Storage Space” feature as the write speeds to a drive created using it are from my experience incredibly slow.
I have one created with 2x Seagate 6TB, 2x WD Red 3TB, 1x Seagate 4TB drive, each drive can be written to individually at around 200Mbp/s but in the Windows Storage Space Drive the max write speed I have seen was 15Mbp/s.
You will need to be careful as Alien says to make sure you get a SATA 6Gb card, which means you want something that will work with SAS-2 drives, but if you can find a decently priced SAS-3 HBA then you will have no issues, just avoid the ones from China as typically they are Broadcom SOC’s which are legit LSI SOC’s but put on to “Home Made Fake” PCB’s.
The Art Of Server on YouTube does some good videos about this stuff I have found and even sells the cards, but they are more expensive that you would pay for one than you would pay for one from a Chinese seller.
I made the mistake of buying a “LSI 9201-16I” from a Chinese Seller and well let’s just say it’s working but I will be replacing it as soon as I have the £400 for a “9305-16I” for my Supermicro Chassis.
If you buy a SAS-2 card it will probably have SFF-8087 connectors so you can buy if they are not included SFF-8087 to 4 Sata breakout cables, and if you get a SAS-3 card then iirc you can also get some SFF-8643 to 4 Sata breakout cables.
Stay away from SAS Drives unless you want to get into the whole “Changing Sector Size” from 520 to 512 so they work with Windows.
Then just make sure you have good airflow over the card because they can get very hot, all of mine have 40mm Noctua fans on them, but the “9201-16I” will be having a 80mm Noctua fan put on it at some point.
The thing is though, you can also get M.2/NVME to SATA splitters if they will work in your motherboard to add more storage without the need for a HBA and whilst it might not be as clean, it may save you some cash if you only need a couple of drives.
You could always look at some large capacity SSD’s in a Mirror Raid setup as most motherboards will support that without needing additional hardware.
I would be surprised if you have more than 1TB of storage space used for games unless you just never uninstall them [FONT="]
[/FONT]KingNosser
Active member
Yea I think so long as i get pci-e 3.0 card with sata 6gb then it'll be ok, but yes i dont uninstall games but atm I have 22.25TB of storage, it'll be about a month before i start thinking about them.
It was art of server i spoke to on his ebay store, but he's linux guy so while helpful left me no clearer, but the 9211-8i card is what i'm thinking about trying.
I know from his YT that china is a no go they are around £70 but i might buy from him and just swallow the postage knowing i'm getting what i pay for as even the UK sellers are similar prices and could end up being china brought.
I dont have any m.2 or nvme space avalible all used on VR and games in play atm and my 2tb ssd is already filled the rest of my storage is mixed for different reasons, a lot of it emu's i have a big collection of stuff but i'd say only half is installed.
art of servers cards are all flashed ready with freenas etc so far i'd say he's the best seller for this type of thing on ebay his prices are decent it's just the postage and time to send but something to think about in around a months time.
It was art of server i spoke to on his ebay store, but he's linux guy so while helpful left me no clearer, but the 9211-8i card is what i'm thinking about trying.
I know from his YT that china is a no go they are around £70 but i might buy from him and just swallow the postage knowing i'm getting what i pay for as even the UK sellers are similar prices and could end up being china brought.
I dont have any m.2 or nvme space avalible all used on VR and games in play atm and my 2tb ssd is already filled the rest of my storage is mixed for different reasons, a lot of it emu's i have a big collection of stuff but i'd say only half is installed.
art of servers cards are all flashed ready with freenas etc so far i'd say he's the best seller for this type of thing on ebay his prices are decent it's just the postage and time to send but something to think about in around a months time.
KingNosser
Active member
https://www.startech.com/en-us/cards-adapters/8p6g-pcie-sata-card
Spotted this seems like a good option for my needs, I don't need raid in any way and price wise on amazon same as if i got a card from art of server.
So in around a month when i have some funds around i see it as a good option and maybe less hassle for my use case, thou sure a different HBA has it's perks just ones i dont need.
All i need is a bunch of drives for storage so i think for me this one is fine, unless any of you feel i should go the LSI HBA route ?
Spotted this seems like a good option for my needs, I don't need raid in any way and price wise on amazon same as if i got a card from art of server.
So in around a month when i have some funds around i see it as a good option and maybe less hassle for my use case, thou sure a different HBA has it's perks just ones i dont need.
All i need is a bunch of drives for storage so i think for me this one is fine, unless any of you feel i should go the LSI HBA route ?
AlienALX
Well-known member
Whoah dude, far too expensive !
Startech make some useful things, but their prices are mad.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/25532014...ui8hwIoPku3Wyhx2RjTGvpvquo|tkp:Bk9SR47SzpDGYQ
Noting the blue denotes SATA III.
I might even have one of those somewhere you can have for nothing. I know I bought one, and TrueNAS refused to see it. I will look here, but I suspect it is at my mother's, I will be over there Friday. mine may even be dual SAS ports too.
Startech make some useful things, but their prices are mad.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/25532014...ui8hwIoPku3Wyhx2RjTGvpvquo|tkp:Bk9SR47SzpDGYQ
Noting the blue denotes SATA III.
I might even have one of those somewhere you can have for nothing. I know I bought one, and TrueNAS refused to see it. I will look here, but I suspect it is at my mother's, I will be over there Friday. mine may even be dual SAS ports too.
AlienALX
Well-known member
You're lucky lol. I threw out all of the SATA II ones. I even have a brand new SAS cable for it.
I will get it packed up in a bit. I do want postage, but nothing else. I know a guy on here sent me a pile of them but I can't remember if this was one. I know I had bought one.
Also has the back up board and capacitors too (acts as a battery if your power goes out to stop data loss) and those cost more than the cards.
KingNosser
Active member
yea i need the 2x sas ports, but dont need raid, but the price on that site is not the same as amazon on there it's just under £100 so art of server's card for the LSI 9201-8i is £73 plus £26 postage works out at the same cost.
The key thing for me is 8 drives and win11 support.
I'm happy to try things but it's just what i spotted seems ok for a similar cost to the LSI 9201-8i.
I'll not jump on it still time to shop around, but if you have an 8 port card i could test i'll be happy to balance transfer it's the windows 11 issue i'm concerned about or my PC disliking the card and not wanting to boot them kind of teething issues i just want something that wont stress me out
plan is to have 8x 3TB drives on the card, then my 6 off mobo do 5 ssds and the dvd drive yes i still use one at times just not atm, the ssds at a later date as i want 3x2TB so over time kind of thing.
as said i dont need a raid card or even software raid just the extra ports, it's such a minefield of cards to pick from and so far them 2 are my options i've discovered takes hours looking at them to know if they will work and do a simple thing
The key thing for me is 8 drives and win11 support.
I'm happy to try things but it's just what i spotted seems ok for a similar cost to the LSI 9201-8i.
I'll not jump on it still time to shop around, but if you have an 8 port card i could test i'll be happy to balance transfer it's the windows 11 issue i'm concerned about or my PC disliking the card and not wanting to boot them kind of teething issues i just want something that wont stress me out
plan is to have 8x 3TB drives on the card, then my 6 off mobo do 5 ssds and the dvd drive yes i still use one at times just not atm, the ssds at a later date as i want 3x2TB so over time kind of thing.
as said i dont need a raid card or even software raid just the extra ports, it's such a minefield of cards to pick from and so far them 2 are my options i've discovered takes hours looking at them to know if they will work and do a simple thing
KingNosser
Active member
I'm stone broke until monday, but i'm good for it, happy to pay for postage etc.
Idk if that card does 8 drives or how sas works in breakout boxes etc did read somewhere a 2 sas can goto 128 drives lol idk anything about this stuff i just want more ports
worth me testing as it's a minefield spent so many hours reading on drivers and types and basic things drives you half mad thou i am anyways
even if that card only does 4 sata, it's still worth me testing as a stop gap as i'll not get more ssd's just yet, wait for prices to come down some more. thou ideal is 8 sata ports for me.
Idk if that card does 8 drives or how sas works in breakout boxes etc did read somewhere a 2 sas can goto 128 drives lol idk anything about this stuff i just want more ports
worth me testing as it's a minefield spent so many hours reading on drivers and types and basic things drives you half mad thou i am anyways
even if that card only does 4 sata, it's still worth me testing as a stop gap as i'll not get more ssd's just yet, wait for prices to come down some more. thou ideal is 8 sata ports for me.
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AlienALX
Well-known member
It's a four port card. Each of the edge connectors splits into 4.
It's a high end one though. X4 with tons of cache. As I say, has the backup cells too.
You can always add another card at a later date.
When you insert it you will know. Shortly before or after post you'll see a message that IIRC says " Press CTRL-A now to enter RAID utility".
You do that, then you go in and set it to JBOD or "just a bunch of disks" which then disables the RAID boot BIOS. What I mean by that is RAID cards are bootable and thus need their own BIOS. You do all of the set up in that BIOS like assigning drives and building RAID arrays etc. It's all very simple. It should also have a low level format utility in there too, which will 0 all of your drives and make sure the data is never recoverable.
It's that RAID bios that Freenas, Truenas etc all hate. Hence why when you hack a card into IT mode it completely removes the BIOS, post post screen and config BIOS. Literally turns it into a dumb controller, which you then manipulate and set up in Freenas itself.
Have packed it. Will chuck it in my rucksack and take it over Friday as I have some DDR4 to send a mate of mine.
It's a high end one though. X4 with tons of cache. As I say, has the backup cells too.
You can always add another card at a later date.
When you insert it you will know. Shortly before or after post you'll see a message that IIRC says " Press CTRL-A now to enter RAID utility".
You do that, then you go in and set it to JBOD or "just a bunch of disks" which then disables the RAID boot BIOS. What I mean by that is RAID cards are bootable and thus need their own BIOS. You do all of the set up in that BIOS like assigning drives and building RAID arrays etc. It's all very simple. It should also have a low level format utility in there too, which will 0 all of your drives and make sure the data is never recoverable.
It's that RAID bios that Freenas, Truenas etc all hate. Hence why when you hack a card into IT mode it completely removes the BIOS, post post screen and config BIOS. Literally turns it into a dumb controller, which you then manipulate and set up in Freenas itself.
Have packed it. Will chuck it in my rucksack and take it over Friday as I have some DDR4 to send a mate of mine.
KingNosser
Active member
Well I'll at least be able to add 4 more drives soon, I'm playing some lost ark atm new area with lunch. I'll pm you my details, but i do not use paypal etc ran into issues with them.
So you can either pm your sort/account or post inside or i can simply send you funds back, your get paid for the costs either way ok
So you can either pm your sort/account or post inside or i can simply send you funds back, your get paid for the costs either way ok
AlienALX
Well-known member
Sorted. I've found a dual port Dell PERC too with no back plate. TBH it doesn't need one. What I don't know is what status the firmware is in. As in whether it's in IT mode or what.
I'll send that with it and you can fiddle with it. Tons of guides out there and even if you brick it you can try again until it is right.
I'll send that with it and you can fiddle with it. Tons of guides out there and even if you brick it you can try again until it is right.
KingNosser
Active member
I've flashed things but not one of these but there lots of guides.
All things to test out and learn something different, my use case compared to most is simple, it's just a shame that it's not made simple win11 kinda mess alot of the sata cards up as i see many comments saying this doesn't work etc in amazon reviews where as the sas cards are more about IT mode guess the server stuff is better supported.
See plenty of sata cards just didnt find anything that would work 100% do not like buying things then not working different if DOA but driver support etc is the key thing.
I know for most people 6 sata ports on mobo and 2 nvme drives is enough but i'm out growing them quickly since so many game are using so much space.
I just like everything installed have stuff from the Atari 2600 to presant day, friends never know what they want to play so we play loads and theme the day either VR racing or random other games.
All things to test out and learn something different, my use case compared to most is simple, it's just a shame that it's not made simple win11 kinda mess alot of the sata cards up as i see many comments saying this doesn't work etc in amazon reviews where as the sas cards are more about IT mode guess the server stuff is better supported.
See plenty of sata cards just didnt find anything that would work 100% do not like buying things then not working different if DOA but driver support etc is the key thing.
I know for most people 6 sata ports on mobo and 2 nvme drives is enough but i'm out growing them quickly since so many game are using so much space.
I just like everything installed have stuff from the Atari 2600 to presant day, friends never know what they want to play so we play loads and theme the day either VR racing or random other games.
AlienALX
Well-known member
TBH most people on Amazon don't know how to load a driver ffs.
In most cases SAS cards need just a driver loaded. And I don't mean automated install packages. I mean loading a driver through device manager and "have disk".
That's what happens when Microsoft hide it all and people have no prior experience. Same with loading a RAID driver before installing.
Both should work 100% in Win 11. So long as they worked from 8 on you should have no problems.
In most cases SAS cards need just a driver loaded. And I don't mean automated install packages. I mean loading a driver through device manager and "have disk".
That's what happens when Microsoft hide it all and people have no prior experience. Same with loading a RAID driver before installing.
Both should work 100% in Win 11. So long as they worked from 8 on you should have no problems.
KingNosser
Active member
Well they do like to make it confusing thats for sure, but it's only confusing when you haven't done something before, i should be fine so long as i take notes follow a guide and take it slow can't be harder than other things i've flashed some old gba stuff i used to use and the last thing was my retro pocket was annoying or generally phones. think with things like these it's about addresses and such setting being correct uefi etc so long as i take my time i think i can break it lol
but there never used a raid card or expansion card so all kinda new to me until now.
Just wish these type of things were more common knowledge then i wouldn't feel like a noob, but it's a minefield of options on what to buy for the same task and so you could easily end up getting something not for your use case and then still need to flash or just have to spend time trying to figure out how to get it working like any issue.
Update:
Just took a look at the layout of the PCIe lanes on my mobo, currently all sata ports are used and both nvme drives are used and that all works fine, issue is the bottom x16 slot runs x4 and is disabled.
so the card has to go into the second x16 slot which runs at pcie 2.0 x8 meaning top x16 pcie 3.0 slot would run at x8 also as it's split, tbh minor really.
If the bottom x16 running at x4 is used for the card the 2nd m.2 can only run in sata, which i don't think nvme drives run in sata but also sata port 3 would need to be disabled to allow this.
bit of a confusing mix due to limited lanes but i checked someone else they have same board and were using a sas card in 2nd x16 8x slot said something about CMS.
So my question is with either card in 2nd x16 running at x8 is there anything i need to do in bios like whql setting or legacy or this CMS or something to get the raid mode to come up on boot or is it just plug it in and it should detect ? so i can set JBOD mode.
Not so concerned about the GPU running in 8x was never an issue with SLI in the past and tbh i expect only a slight loss in performance so it's just more i think it'll work fine just wondering if anything i need to know when installing it ?
but there never used a raid card or expansion card so all kinda new to me until now.
Just wish these type of things were more common knowledge then i wouldn't feel like a noob, but it's a minefield of options on what to buy for the same task and so you could easily end up getting something not for your use case and then still need to flash or just have to spend time trying to figure out how to get it working like any issue.
Update:
Just took a look at the layout of the PCIe lanes on my mobo, currently all sata ports are used and both nvme drives are used and that all works fine, issue is the bottom x16 slot runs x4 and is disabled.
so the card has to go into the second x16 slot which runs at pcie 2.0 x8 meaning top x16 pcie 3.0 slot would run at x8 also as it's split, tbh minor really.
If the bottom x16 running at x4 is used for the card the 2nd m.2 can only run in sata, which i don't think nvme drives run in sata but also sata port 3 would need to be disabled to allow this.
bit of a confusing mix due to limited lanes but i checked someone else they have same board and were using a sas card in 2nd x16 8x slot said something about CMS.
So my question is with either card in 2nd x16 running at x8 is there anything i need to do in bios like whql setting or legacy or this CMS or something to get the raid mode to come up on boot or is it just plug it in and it should detect ? so i can set JBOD mode.
Not so concerned about the GPU running in 8x was never an issue with SLI in the past and tbh i expect only a slight loss in performance so it's just more i think it'll work fine just wondering if anything i need to know when installing it ?
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KingNosser
Active member
Big thanks to Alien for the SAS cards.
After flashing in a clueless manner have the 8 port dell card working nicely maybe not perfectly in terms of function but it has 4 drives attached to it working correctly normal speeds for sata mech hdds 120-140 read and 120 write so pretty normal.
Maybe in the next 8 weeks i'll be where i wish too be with storage.
plan to add 4x4tb hdds to the 2nd port on the sas card.
as i have spare ports on mobo now was able to make use of the dvd drive again, yes tom i know but i do like to use it at times for different reasons.
but will add another 2 2tb crucial mx500's and plan to replace OS drive with the same.
Which will bring me to 44tb's bar the normal loss on a drive.
did take me some time and working out but with some useful help from alien it's all working, just a matter of time to save a little now to pick the next batch of drives up.
so i expect once thats all done i'll not be doing anything to my PC until a GPU upgrade at some point as Idk when i'll want or need a newer CPU just yet i'd expect maybe 5 years but GPU will like always come around sooner, so after spending a fair old wack on my system since december time i'm so nearly done shelling out on it more, the case upgrade due to some damage worked out more than i'd have liked.
but if you look at nas prices it's pretty much the same, unless you DIY which is kinda what i've intended with the case switch, the main cost is the ssd prices as £125 for 2tbs is about where they sit atm, sure do hope they come down some more and maybe 4tb will become the new £125 mark.
But overall very happy and thankful to alien for the cards
hey i didnt break it no PC blew up today success
After flashing in a clueless manner have the 8 port dell card working nicely maybe not perfectly in terms of function but it has 4 drives attached to it working correctly normal speeds for sata mech hdds 120-140 read and 120 write so pretty normal.
Maybe in the next 8 weeks i'll be where i wish too be with storage.
plan to add 4x4tb hdds to the 2nd port on the sas card.
as i have spare ports on mobo now
was able to make use of the dvd drive again, yes tom i know but i do like to use it at times for different reasons.but will add another 2 2tb crucial mx500's and plan to replace OS drive with the same.
Which will bring me to 44tb's bar the normal loss on a drive.
did take me some time and working out but with some useful help from alien it's all working, just a matter of time to save a little now to pick the next batch of drives up.
so i expect once thats all done i'll not be doing anything to my PC until a GPU upgrade at some point as Idk when i'll want or need a newer CPU just yet i'd expect maybe 5 years but GPU will like always come around sooner, so after spending a fair old wack on my system since december time i'm so nearly done shelling out on it more, the case upgrade due to some damage worked out more than i'd have liked.
but if you look at nas prices it's pretty much the same, unless you DIY which is kinda what i've intended with the case switch, the main cost is the ssd prices as £125 for 2tbs is about where they sit atm, sure do hope they come down some more and maybe 4tb will become the new £125 mark.
But overall very happy and thankful to alien for the cards
hey i didnt break it no PC blew up today success
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