Dragons in Indonesia?

SeekaX said:
not being an atheist doesn't mean that you believe in god as he is described by some religion. atheism in general is mistaken for not believing in christianity/judaism/the islam. but it actually means that you believe that there was no conscious being involved in our existence, but if there was no conscious mind behind our existence, then why are there the rules of physics? an existence without a conscious mind setting the rules seems very unlikely and very chaotic.
we had a thread a couple days ago about the idea of us living in some sort of a simulation, if that scenario was true then that would make the programmer the conscious being that created us and therefore in a way "god".
i don't follow any religion or any kind of theory for our existence, thinking that we know the answer even though we aren't even able to observe 90% of the universe, which also means that saying there defiantly is no god is just as ignorant as saying that some religion is without a doubt true.
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That's why I said divine intervention dude, as in any type of other worldly being, God or entity having an involvement in our creation or evolution.

We don't know the answers to everything, but most of what we do know is basically proven by science. Some things are still labeled as "theories" like gravity and evolution through natural causes. We all know they aren't really theories and that the math and evidence supporting them out ways the possibility of them being anything other than scientific fact.

There is definitely something out there that we are unaware off, like were did space come from and what is beyond it. All things come from something, we know where we came from and where the planets, moons, starts and elements came from. The bigger question is where does space come from, what caused it and why is it there.
 
SieB said:
That's why I said divine intervention dude, as in any type of other worldly being, God or entity having an involvement in our creation or evolution.

We don't know the answers to everything, but most of what we do know is basically proven by science. Some things are still labeled as "theories" like gravity and evolution through natural causes. We all know they aren't really theories and that the math and evidence supporting them out ways the possibility of them being anything other than scientific fact.

There is definitely something out there that we are unaware off, like were did space come from and what is beyond it. All things come from something, we know where we came from and where the planets, moons, starts and elements came from. The bigger question is where does space come from, what caused it and why is it there.
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right on the money mate.
the problem with science is that science won't be able to clear up what happened prior to the big bang, that is something a lot of physicists are pretty sure about.
i don't think of god as someone who judges us or communicates with us, i don't even like the term god, i'd rather call that conscious being "the creator". sounds dramatic, but fits a lot better because it takes the whole spiritual part away.
i spent a lot of time trying to think of ways that would explain our existence, even with that conscious being creating us i am running into the infinity problem, but that still seems a lot more likely than getting rules from nowhere.
it's a very hard subject to think about, but i don't think we should limit our perspective by ruling out one of the most important theories just because people misinterpreted them in the past.
 
I had a dream i died once and it was really really weird. It felt like i was falling and spinning with my head as the axis instead of my body which is the centre gravity or how ever you say it.
 
maniac said:
Can anyone confirm that I feel enlightened after reading all of this?, I am not saying I believe it, I just love the ideas presented through it.
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yeah even though I know for a fact it's fiction coz the author even admitted it was. I still love the ideas throughout. I think the god in the story would be a far more enjoyable basis for belief in god. especially as it's not a god who wants to be worshipped but rather help us achieve our maximum potential
 
WillSK said:
yeah even though I know for a fact it's fiction coz the author even admitted it was. I still love the ideas throughout. I think the god in the story would be a far more enjoyable basis for belief in god. especially as it's not a god who wants to be worshipped but rather help us achieve our maximum potential
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i am pretty sure that the whole worship stuff came from greedy people, it just contradicts too badly with the point of religion.
 
Let's not turn this into a religious arguement now, shall we? :)

Truth is that people will always believe in things like dragons and UFOs cause we know nothing about them and unknown things are exciting. It's how people work, I guess.
 
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Feronix said:
Let's not turn this into a religious arguement now, shall we? :)

Truth is that people will always believe in things like dragons and UFO cause we know nothing about them and unknown things are exciting. It's how people work, I guess.
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why not? it's not like it's out of context.
 
I'll just put my thoughts in. From the beginning of modern history, stories of star people, dragons, angels etc have been found all round the world, on different continents, different cultures who never convened, let alone knew about each others existence.

Ancient cultures would have found it difficult to explain what they saw, so they used metaphors etc, they did not have pop-culture, the media etc, how would an ancient culture explain something like a 'dragon,' or a UFO etc.

There are hundreds of examples round the world, in painting, scripture, wall painting (American Indians), again, none of these people ever met, yet they saw 'something' eerily similar. Whatever they saw must have had some correlation. I believe in UFOs, star people whatever you call them, thats what I think these stories of dragons, gods etc are, but ancient people did not have the vocabulary/ past experience of whatever or whoever was in front of their very eyes. Dragons in particular, if you look at Chinese and Indian history would come down from the skies, in a bright light, Gods would come down on 'chariots.' Laugh at me if you want, I just have an open mind, I think it would be naive to be so narrow minded not to take into consideration the existence of what our ancient ancestors perceived.

How would you explain something like this:

 
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SeekaX said:
i am pretty sure that the whole worship stuff came from greedy people, it just contradicts too badly with the point of religion.
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couldn't agree more dude. Organised Religion is a broken system (in my opinion). As you've said in a previous post, I also don't completely denounce the possibility of a "god, creator, wizard" whatever you wish to call it but I don't believe in the traditional god that supposedly popped us out in 7 days and says poo poo to evolution and so on. The reason there will always be debate is because science will only ever take us to a point and then we will still be able to ask "well what about before that?"
 
WillSK said:
couldn't agree more dude. Organised Religion is a broken system (in my opinion). As you've said in a previous post, I also don't completely denounce the possibility of a "god, creator, wizard" whatever you wish to call it but I don't believe in the traditional god that supposedly popped us out in 7 days and says poo poo to evolution and so on. The reason there will always be debate is because science will only ever take us to a point and then we will still be able to ask "well what about before that?"
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i suppose most religions are made to be easily understood, to put everything into an understandable timescale for the simple minded people.
to be fair, both religion and science fail on that question, saying that some god created us pretty much forces to ask where god came from, saying that god has been around forever is about as satisfying as saying that the universe exists for no reason.
every theory collapses on logic, everything needs a cause, somewhere it doesn't apply anymore. to be exact it doesn't apply anymore prior to the big bang, but that's also the barrier for our perception.
 
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