New AMD build advice / questions

[Ricky685]

Hi

Ok, so... I already have my case (Jonsbo umx4) psu (evga 650w G2) 750gb Ssd, 2 x 500gb Hdd, and I'm looking to build an AMD based "jack of all trades" home pc.
Uses are going to be Family PC / HTPC / Home server / Gaming (mid level, nothing to expert, but would like to play most AAA games) / VR HTC Vive. I have to decide on the following:
CPU - probably Ryzen 7 1700 although I will wait for Ryzen 5
M/Board - probably CH6 or Prime
Ram - recommended 3000mhz
GPU - undecided.
is it possible to have a multi monitor set up, in the following config:
Main TV connected via hdmi to GPU then connect a monitor via display port then connect the VIVE to a display port via an adapter?
Then is it possible to output say a movie to the TV and then output a game to the monitor simultaneously?
Is is possible to output the correct audio to each screen simultaneously?
I'm sure I watched a review of a motherboard which could output different audio sources to different outputs, I might have dreamt this though.
If all this is possible would the 1700 cope with the workload and which GPU would you recommend?
Appreciate any thoughts, advice and recommendations

 

[AngryGoldfish]

I can't answer the monitor or audio question as they go beyond my experience. I use external audio and have never bothered with multiple monitors.

I'd suggest waiting for Ryzen 5. It won't bring greater gaming performance but it will be cheaper. Disabling two cores and four threads in Ryzen 7 actually reduces frame rates slightly so unless clock speeds are dramatically improved with Ryzen 5 it will be the AMD gaming chip to go for simply because it is cheaper than the R7 range and not because it is more suited for it. Either way don't bother with the 1700X or 1800X. The 1700 will handle almost any load. Its only drawback is its 1080p high refresh rate performance. It is sadly limited in that area, at least currently.

For GPU's I'd suggest waiting until May when Vega is at least fully announced and we have a strong idea of its performance and most importantly its price. Then buy the GPU that fits your budget and needs. If you play a lot of games like GTA V, Watch Dogs 2, The Witcher 3 then go Nvidia. If you play games like Deus Ex, Hitman, COD, then go AMD. If you play BF1, Fallout 4, Rainbow Six Siege then it really doesn't matter. Come May we should have a very clear path of the following year. Pascal might be refreshed at some point, but we have very little information on that at the moment so don't bank on it. To me the 1080 and 1060 have already been refreshed, but I could be wrong.

Be mindful that 3000Mhz may not be possible even if it's suggested as compliant by AMD, ASUS, or the RAM manufacturers. There are just too many variables at the moment. I won't be buying Ryzen until these aspects are ironed out at least partially. You can always buy 3000Mhz Ryzen-compliant memory and downclock until you find stability, if you need to.

 

[Ricky685]

Thanks for the advice, Defo going to wait for Ryzen 5, I've waited 5 month for Ryzen 7 so another few weeks ain't going kill me. ATM 1700 is top of the list and I quite like the cooler, I've seen one review of it by Kyle at bitwit and it seems to perform pretty well for a stock.

It would be cool to find out about the monitor and audio question as it's my aim to stream a movie for the kids so I can have a gaming session in peace, lol.

I have budgeted for a 1070 GPU, but AMD's 580 refresh might be an option? vega might be too far away tbh

 

[NickOmega]

Plex might be a reasonable option if you have a smart TV. Would allow you to stream the film and the correct audio without added faff.

For physical connection (HDMI),; know in VLC you can specify an output device for the audio track, which can be different to your primary output, but not sure how well it works since I've not tried doing it like that.
When the missus wants to watch something my movies folder is shared on home network and played through a Raspberry Pi/Kodi box on the TV in the other room.

 

[Ricky685]

Yeh, I'll probably use plex to access stored movies. I have a android tv box now which is old and tired, I wanted rid of this and to run Kodi from the pc. I had heard VLC was capable of this but
The Crosshair x370 has this feature - would this work?

 

[Reloaded2]

I can't answer the monitor or audio question as they go beyond my experience. I use external audio and have never bothered with multiple monitors.

I'd suggest waiting for Ryzen 5. It won't bring greater gaming performance but it will be cheaper. Disabling two cores and four threads in Ryzen 7 actually reduces frame rates slightly so unless clock speeds are dramatically improved with Ryzen 5 it will be the AMD gaming chip to go for simply because it is cheaper than the R7 range and not because it is more suited for it. Either way don't bother with the 1700X or 1800X. The 1700 will handle almost any load. Its only drawback is its 1080p high refresh rate performance. It is sadly limited in that area, at least currently.

For GPU's I'd suggest waiting until May when Vega is at least fully announced and we have a strong idea of its performance and most importantly its price. Then buy the GPU that fits your budget and needs. If you play a lot of games like GTA V, Watch Dogs 2, The Witcher 3 then go Nvidia. If you play games like Deus Ex, Hitman, COD, then go AMD. If you play BF1, Fallout 4, Rainbow Six Siege then it really doesn't matter. Come May we should have a very clear path of the following year. Pascal might be refreshed at some point, but we have very little information on that at the moment so don't bank on it. To me the 1080 and 1060 have already been refreshed, but I could be wrong.

Be mindful that 3000Mhz may not be possible even if it's suggested as compliant by AMD, ASUS, or the RAM manufacturers. There are just too many variables at the moment. I won't be buying Ryzen until these aspects are ironed out at least partially. You can always buy 3000Mhz Ryzen-compliant memory and downclock until you find stability, if you need to.

If we are talking 1060 vs 480 etc then in games like witcher etc they are neck and neck. AMD or nvidia isnt better. If we are taking 1070 vs 480 and he has the budget for it then the 1070 is the option.

Wait for the 580 to come out. See what performance is like then make the decision.

 

[NickOmega]

Yeh, I'll probably use plex to access stored movies. I have a android tv box now which is old and tired, I wanted rid of this and to run Kodi from the pc. I had heard VLC was capable of this but
The Crosshair x370 has this feature - would this work?

Looking at the attached screenshot it appears you can choose which audio device you want to use for specific programs, so I would assume "yes".

However, Kodi also already allows you to specify which audio device you want to use.

 

[AngryGoldfish]

If we are talking 1060 vs 480 etc then in games like witcher etc they are neck and neck. AMD or nvidia isnt better. If we are taking 1070 vs 480 and he has the budget for it then the 1070 is the option.

Wait for the 580 to come out. See what performance is like then make the decision.

Neck and neck is not exactly true.

1060 clearly wins:
http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/msi_geforce_gtx_1060_aero_itx_review,26.html

1060 wins:
https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/GTX_1060_Armor/25.html

1060 wins (however this is an early review with older drivers):
http://techreport.com/review/30812/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1060-graphics-card-reviewed/13

1060 comes close to a Fury X at 1080p:
http://hardwareoverclock.com/MSI-GeForce-GTX-1060-GAMING-X-3G-6.htm

1060 wins:
https://www.hardwareluxx.de/index.p...eforce-gtx-1060-gaming-x-im-test.html?start=9

These were the first reviews I found that tested The Witcher 3. They are not cherrypicked. Maybe drivers have matured so that the RX 480 is indeed neck and neck with the 1060, but from what I've seen the 1060 is the winner in TW3.

 

[NeverBackDown]

You're nitpicking on what neck and neck is...
It's literally just a few frame difference. You are not going to notice. Especially since you are testing new 1060s on newer driver's, yet the 480s on there aren't being retested. Neck and neck seems appropriate, especially over the average of many games.

 

[AngryGoldfish]

You're nitpicking on what neck and neck is...
It's literally just a few frame difference. You are not going to notice. Especially since you are testing new 1060s on newer driver's, yet the 480s on there aren't being retested. Neck and neck seems appropriate, especially over the average of many games.

Nitpicking is all that you have when there is so little in it. That's my point. If a GPU is 'neck and neck' yet there is still a definitive winner, even if it's only by a small amount why choose the slower card if that's the game you play? Why choose an RX 480 over a GTX 1060 if you play GTA V a lot? There isn't much to differentiate the two GPU's. They're both pretty much as good as each other. But in GTA V Nvidia takes the lead. That's undeniable.

As for The Witcher 3, you are right. I forgot to take into account that reviewers don't retest their RX 480's for their 1060 reviews. I just looked up two more recent RX 480 reviews and in The Witcher 3 the difference is within margin of error. In fact, the 480 was a weensy bit ahead. Those were the first two I looked at. If you play The Witcher 3 then an RX 480 is equally as appropriate as the 1060.

http://hardwareoverclock.com/Sapphire-Nitro-Plus-Radeon-RX-480-4G-D5-5a.htm

http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/xfx_rx480_gtr/6.htm

 

[Ricky685]

Looking at the attached screenshot it appears you can choose which audio device you want to use for specific programs, so I would assume "yes".

However, Kodi also already allows you to specify which audio device you want to use.

Sounds good, so let assume I can live stream a movie to the TV in one room running on Kodi, and I can play Dirt rally in another on a monitor let's say at 1080p high using a steering wheel set up, hooked up to a 1070 GPU, Audio playing simultaneously to each monitor...
Would the Ryzen 1700 cope better than an say an I7 7700k in this scenario?

 

[Reloaded2]

Nitpicking is all that you have when there is so little in it. That's my point. If a GPU is 'neck and neck' yet there is still a definitive winner, even if it's only by a small amount why choose the slower card if that's the game you play? Why choose an RX 480 over a GTX 1060 if you play GTA V a lot? There isn't much to differentiate the two GPU's. They're both pretty much as good as each other. But in GTA V Nvidia takes the lead. That's undeniable.

As for The Witcher 3, you are right. I forgot to take into account that reviewers don't retest their RX 480's for their 1060 reviews. I just looked up two more recent RX 480 reviews and in The Witcher 3 the difference is within margin of error. In fact, the 480 was a weensy bit ahead. Those were the first two I looked at. If you play The Witcher 3 then an RX 480 is equally as appropriate as the 1060.

http://hardwareoverclock.com/Sapphire-Nitro-Plus-Radeon-RX-480-4G-D5-5a.htm

http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/xfx_rx480_gtr/6.htm

NBD is correct that they were neck and neck back then and you are correct now to say the 480 is slightly better now in 2017 and I think that is a trend that will hold true down 2017 and into 2018 (especially finewine and DX12 support)

And anyways my 480 beats any 1060 (and 480 as a matter of fact). I get an average of 75fps on witcher all on ultra and hairworks on medium @ 1080p - by far better than any 1060 even with a high overclock

I do believe INITIALLY the 1060 was the "definitive winner" around June 2016 but now in March 2017 the RX 480 by far the better option (in terms of nit picking) and there is no reason not to go with it (unless you have a gsync monitor).

Also Ricky wait until the 580 comes out to see what Amd offer

 

[NickOmega]

Sounds good, so let assume I can live stream a movie to the TV in one room running on Kodi, and I can play Dirt rally in another on a monitor let's say at 1080p high using a steering wheel set up, hooked up to a 1070 GPU, Audio playing simultaneously to each monitor...
Would the Ryzen 1700 cope better than an say an I7 7700k in this scenario?

If you're simply file sharing over your network to a dedicated Kodi box of some kind, which I assume is what you mean since you said stream to another room, all the video/audio decoding takes place on the Kodi device with next to no impact on your host/computer.

In which case the 7700K would "cope" better since it's currently stronger in gaming than the R7 Ryzen.

If you're running Kodi on your PC and physically connecting to the TV via a HDMI then that puts marginally more stress on your computer but Kodi is a relatively light load on your CPU anyway so I'm not sure how much difference it would actually make. Maybe someone with either an R7 or 7700k could weigh in with their experience of running Kodi.

 

[Ricky685]

Ok thanks, Apologies for my naivety. I guess what I'm trying to get my head around is.... all the Ryzen 7 reviews state is great for gaming and streaming at the same time (upload/encoding?). Is this the same scenario as gaming and streaming at the same time (download/decoding?) as in my scenario.
Appreciate the your advice pal, cheers

 

[Reloaded2]

Ok thanks, Apologies for my naivety. I guess what I'm trying to get my head around is.... all the Ryzen 7 reviews state is great for gaming and streaming at the same time (upload/encoding?). Is this the same scenario as gaming and streaming at the same time (download/decoding?) as in my scenario.
Appreciate the your advice pal, cheers

Have you chosen your GPU? If not I strongly suggest you wait until AMD announce their new GPU's. AMD have played it safe this year with the RX480 which was aimed at the sweetspot 1080p performance at half the TDP of a Fury X and lower temps but many people are counting AMD to release their new GPU's which are going to enter back into the high end market and wont be aimed at the 1060; these will be direct competitors to the 1080 and 1080ti.

That's why strongly recommend you wait a bit before buying a new GPU.

 

[Ricky685]

Have you chosen your GPU? If not I strongly suggest you wait until AMD announce their new GPU's. AMD have played it safe this year with the RX480 which was aimed at the sweetspot 1080p performance at half the TDP of a Fury X and lower temps but many people are counting AMD to release their new GPU's which are going to enter back into the high end market and wont be aimed at the 1060; these will be direct competitors to the 1080 and 1080ti.

That's why I think you should wait a bit before buying a new GPU.

No mate, not chosen GPU, kind of budgeted for a 1070ish performance, reason for this is I would like to add in VR capabilities. I have had a few goes up to now mainly with the HTC Vive and was blown away with it... awesome
vega is the next big release i suppose, but were look at a May launch I think... not sure I can wait that long

 

[Reloaded2]

No mate, not chosen GPU, kind of budgeted for a 1070ish performance, reason for this is I would like to add in VR capabilities. I have had a few goes up to now mainly with the HTC Vive and was blown away with it... awesome
vega is the next big release i suppose, but were look at a May launch I think... not sure I can wait that long

Thats why I think you should wait until AMD at least announce their GPU's. They will give us 1080 or 1080ti performance at lower prices (not too much lower) which will then cause the 1070 and 1080 to go down in prices to compete and so on. That's my prediction and I think its a good idea to wait a little while.

As of right now there is still a lot that we do not know about the AMD Vega and whether or not it will be able to compete with the Titan XP or the GTX 1080 Ti but what's waiting a few months? - you will get better deals and possibly better performance

 

[Ricky685]

Thats why I think you should wait until AMD at least announce their GPU's. They will give us 1080 or 1080ti performance at lower prices (not too much lower) which will then cause the 1070 and 1080 to go down in prices to compete and so on. That's my prediction and I think its a good idea to wait a little while.

Whats waiting a few months? - you will get better deals and possibly better performance

Yes your probably right, I'm waiting on Ryzen 5 benchmark's to decide on which cpu, so that's mid April..... I guess I could beg, Steal, borrow a low end GPU to get started and set up and then wait for Vega

 

[NickOmega]

Ok thanks, Apologies for my naivety. I guess what I'm trying to get my head around is.... all the Ryzen 7 reviews state is great for gaming and streaming at the same time (upload/encoding?). Is this the same scenario as gaming and streaming at the same time (download/decoding?) as in my scenario.
Appreciate the your advice pal, cheers

It's not really the same thing. Encoding a live twitch stream is significantly more taxing than playing an existing video file. That is where the higher core/thread count actually is beneficial.
For example: When I have streamed PS4 gameplay via capture card and OBS (30 FPS @720p, 2500kbps bitrate) the cpu usage on my FX-6300 was around 30-40% just processing the stream, it doesn't use near that while watching 1080p videos

I think the 7700k at the moment would still give slightly better game performance with such a light task as playing a video at the same time, but with the caveat that the Ryzen chips are new and optimisations are still in the works.

It's also worth considering that AM4 is intended to be supported for a few years whereas I believe* 1151 is nearing the end of its life, leaving no CPU upgrade path without also requiring a new motherboard.

*Not 100% on this but I'm sure someone will either confirm or correct

It's also not too long a wait to see what kind of performance the 6c12t R5 range brings to the table as well.

 

[Reloaded2]

Yes your probably right, I'm waiting on Ryzen 5 benchmark's to decide on which cpu, so that's mid April..... I guess I could beg, Steal, borrow a low end GPU to get started and set up and then wait for Vega

It's going to be worth it in the long run trust me.