Fallout 4, Preview Analysis.

[Jbo1234]

you don't see how anything has changed.....did you not watch it or something?

Yes, and the actual gameplay is the same. All they did is throw in some city builder and crafting system to distract people from the fact that a) all these features could have been done years ago b) the core game is identical. Any destructible scenery, object penetration, or anything that will improve the fps element of an fps rpg? Nope - nothing, which is exactly what I predicted when I could tell they were using the same engine (just revamped again).

 

[Tripp]

Yes, and the actual gameplay is the same. All they did is throw in some city builder and crafting system to distract people from the fact that a) all these features could have been done years ago b) the core game is identical. Any destructible scenery, object penetration, or anything that will improve the fps element of an fps rpg? Nope - nothing, which is exactly what I predicted when I could tell they were using the same engine (just revamped again).

Im not even going to waste my energy,if you dont like it dont buy the game....simple

 

[Jbo1234]

Im not even going to waste my energy,if you dont like it dont buy the game....simple

I won't buy it and you can go ahead and buy as many copies if that makes you happy, but don't complain when someone posts fair criticism about the game and then you go and use standard excuse replies of "I won't waste my time/energy", "It's so obvious why your wrong I won't bother trying" etc. If it was so obvious you could counter my points in a few words and show how I was wrong/missing something etc. Don't think I've not seen all these excuses to not argue before. Though I will just say that i like being right yet again about a game.

 

[Feronix]

No one said you're wrong, but they can still disagree with your opinion.

Now drop the attitude.

 

[Wraith]

(remember this is a discussion not an argument, always respect the views of others)

~Wraithguard~​

I made this abundantly clear in the OP, there is no need for flaming or aggressive posting. We're all friends here.

 

[NeverBackDown]

I made this abundantly clear in the OP, there is no need for flaming or aggressive posting. We're all friends here.

Some people can't resist the urge to "argue"

Me personally on the game, I think the graphics look horrible in the current state. I think it's on level with Vanilla Skyrim, which isn't saying much. I hope they improve it. Other than that I got nothing against Fallout so far. Graphics don't make a game but it sure does help immerse you.

 

[SPS]

I never understood that argument. Here's a a new game of one of my favourite franchises, oh look they haven't even changed the gameplay drastically, too bad it will be like playing a next gen version of the first game that I really liked with a much larger world and brand new story line..

If they changed it too much it's no longer part of the original franchise/IP, if they don't change it enough then they're lazy.. Honestly.

 

[Doomslayer]

Fallout 4 looks fine to me but i will not be buying it when it first comes out i will wait until Steam has it on sale and plus i have never played a Fallout game but i do have them in my Steam Library tho.

 

[barnsley]

If it was so obvious you could counter my points in a few words and show how I was wrong/missing something etc. Don't think I've not seen all these excuses to not argue before. Though I will just say that i like being right yet again about a game.

Even I've seen some differences thus far and I'm not even a huge fan of the series. Oh well, I guess you only see what proves your own argument.

I'm also not one to jump to conclusions~

 

[Jbo1234]

Even I've seen some differences thus far and I'm not even a huge fan of the series. Oh well, I guess you only see what proves your own argument.

I'm also not one to jump to conclusions~

If the game was in alpha or earlier, then sure - jumping to conclusions would be hasty. But it isn't as its coming out pretty soon and as I mentioned, there is no next gen change or improvement to the fps element which is at the core of the game. The gun customisation is exactly like the type from Dead Space 3 which is good, but I want to see more and see all the tools of a next gen engine deliver a truly next gen game.

I never understood that argument. Here's a a new game of one of my favourite franchises, oh look they haven't even changed the gameplay drastically, too bad it will be like playing a next gen version of the first game that I really liked with a much larger world and brand new story line..

If they changed it too much it's no longer part of the original franchise/IP, if they don't change it enough then they're lazy.. Honestly.

How are the things I listed drastic? Sure, the Red Faction Series or SupCom killed themselves by making sure their sequels had every good part removed from them and having nothing in common with its prequel. But when did I ask for that? If I said drop the pip-boy then yes, that would be totally moronic and a good step to killing FO. But asking for next gen features like total physics, destructible scenery, weather that changes the environment, seasons etc are not game breakers. We all know they are fair requests that would only make the game better and can be done by a lot of next gen engines. So then why is it not in the game?

 

[SPS]

But asking for next gen features like total physics, destructible scenery, weather that changes the environment, seasons etc are not game breakers are they? We all know they are fair requests that would only make the game better and can be done by a lot of next gen engines. So then why is it not in the game?

Not IMO they're not - waste of time.

Total physics - what even is that. Basic rigid body sim on props is fine.
Destructible scenery - Not interested in the slightest bit, sounds like it would completely break an open world RPG.
Weather - Can be a nice addition but I prefer clear skies almost all the time.
Seasons - Please re-prioritize, let's put those man-hours into some extra content.

 

[AlienALX]

I never understood that argument. Here's a a new game of one of my favourite franchises, oh look they haven't even changed the gameplay drastically, too bad it will be like playing a next gen version of the first game that I really liked with a much larger world and brand new story line..

If they changed it too much it's no longer part of the original franchise/IP, if they don't change it enough then they're lazy.. Honestly.

Absolutely spot on.

I've already explained that content wise a game like this can take years to make. A far cry from something from EA that lasts for about four hours. Programming the content to last 50 hours takes considerably more effort.

That's why it looks a tiny bit dated. They could do a Duke Nukem and start from scratch but look what happened there.

I think a lot of people forget the key point here. It's a new Fallout game with new graphics. That's all I asked for. The modding community will sort out the rest.

BTW as for Gameplay changes? The dog is new. Well not new as in a companion but now you have full control over it and can send it to fetch things and so on. I always used to tell my companions to bugger off but if the dog is actually useful I will keep him around.

The major gameplay changes will be in the quests and story and how they play out. It's a Fallout game and Bethesda's underlying RPG mechanics are proven great. It's kinda like South Park : The stick of truth. Underneath it was basically Paper Mario with special moves but that didn't stop me loving every single moment of it. In fact it was the best game I played that year.

I think some one is questioning things a little too hard, almost like a conspiracy is being committed here ffs.

 

[Jbo1234]

Not IMO they're not - waste of time.

Total physics - what even is that. Basic rigid body sim on props is fine.
Destructible scenery - Not interested in the slightest bit, sounds like it would completely break an open world RPG.
Weather - Can be a nice addition but I prefer clear skies almost all the time.
Seasons - Please re-prioritize, let's put those man-hours into some extra content.

Well those were mechanics off the top of my head, but bare with me as I'll explain why there is more to them. Total physics allows for cloth movement, water etc so you could have entire areas redesigned and far more immersive. Imagine flash floods being a danger or your new town being washed away. The weapons would be different as bullets would blow chunks out of people and lasers would burn nice holes. That would be hilarious to see, especially if you had something like a claymore go off. The scenery would make a huge difference and I don't think you have realised how far it goes. You need to attack some hut - so you rinse the side of it rather than the horribly old fashioned "approach door and loading screen". Again, you could burn someone out of a hut or be burnt alive in one yourself. It would nicely overhaul some mechanics and reasons for weapons (because in all FO3 and LV there were obvious best weapons which made everything else pointless").
Why do you want clear skies? Ok that is your preference but not only is that boring, it is not immersive and I doubt many people want that (think about the volume of weather mods for Skyrim - people like variety).
Season - again, this could change the day to day mechanics. Scorching heat dries up a lake, you can explore it. Snow blocks off areas and have avalanche dangers etc. It just adds to it.

But in short, if gamers didn't push for change we would never of had any mechanics such as weather, day-night cycles etc. Why do people want to now settle for minor changes which could have come in an expansion pack?

 

[Wraith]

Well those were mechanics off the top of my head, but bare with me as I'll explain why there is more to them. Total physics allows for cloth movement, water etc so you could have entire areas redesigned and far more immersive. Imagine flash floods being a danger or your new town being washed away. The weapons would be different as bullets would blow chunks out of people and lasers would burn nice holes. That would be hilarious to see, especially if you had something like a claymore go off. The scenery would make a huge difference and I don't think you have realised how far it goes. You need to attack some hut - so you rinse the side of it rather than the horribly old fashioned "approach door and loading screen". Again, you could burn someone out of a hut or be burnt alive in one yourself. It would nicely overhaul some mechanics and reasons for weapons (because in all FO3 and LV there were obvious best weapons which made everything else pointless").
Why do you want clear skies? Ok that is your preference but not only is that boring, it is not immersive and I doubt many people want that (think about the volume of weather mods for Skyrim - people like variety).
Season - again, this could change the day to day mechanics. Scorching heat dries up a lake, you can explore it. Snow blocks off areas and have avalanche dangers etc. It just adds to it.

But in short, if gamers didn't push for change we would never of had any mechanics such as weather, day-night cycles etc. Why do people want to now settle for minor changes which could have come in an expansion pack?

I would love to see all this in a game, but as far as Engines that could pull all this off "today" not many could, plus you'd need a Titan X just to be able to experience it all maybe even SLI'd Titans, all that PhysX and direct compute is going to rape your hardware. The improvements that Beth has made to Creation is all new, and a first time out with FO4, Tesselation, volumetric lighting, cascade shadowing, SOAA, FXAA all this newness bolted to the Engine is a welcoming thing for me, we got none of this with Skyrim even TESO. The proof will be in the pudding so to speak.

 

[SPS]

Well those were mechanics off the top of my head, but bare with me as I'll explain why there is more to them. Total physics allows for cloth movement, water etc so you could have entire areas redesigned and far more immersive. Imagine flash floods being a danger or your new town being washed away. The weapons would be different as bullets would blow chunks out of people and lasers would burn nice holes. That would be hilarious to see, especially if you had something like a claymore go off. The scenery would make a huge difference and I don't think you have realised how far it goes. You need to attack some hut - so you rinse the side of it rather than the horribly old fashioned "approach door and loading screen". Again, you could burn someone out of a hut or be burnt alive in one yourself. It would nicely overhaul some mechanics and reasons for weapons (because in all FO3 and LV there were obvious best weapons which made everything else pointless").
Why do you want clear skies? Ok that is your preference but not only is that boring, it is not immersive and I doubt many people want that (think about the volume of weather mods for Skyrim - people like variety).
Season - again, this could change the day to day mechanics. Scorching heat dries up a lake, you can explore it. Snow blocks off areas and have avalanche dangers etc. It just adds to it.

But in short, if gamers didn't push for change we would never of had any mechanics such as weather, day-night cycles etc. Why do people want to now settle for minor changes which could have come in an expansion pack?

A lot of stuff you listed would completely restrict a lot of game content and just introduce so many potential bugs. Games are already one of the most complex software to write and I'd rather have a solid well designed game play experience over a tech demo.

 

[Jbo1234]

I would love to see all this in a game, but as far as Engines that could pull all this off "today" not many could, plus you'd need a Titan X just to be able to experience it all maybe even SLI'd Titans, all that PhysX and direct compute is going to rape your hardware. The improvements that Beth has made to Creation is all new, and a first time out with FO4, Tesselation, volumetric lighting, cascade shadowing, SOAA, FXAA all this newness bolted to the Engine is a welcoming thing for me, we got none of this with Skyrim even TESO. The proof will be in the pudding so to speak.

I'm not sure it would be so brutal on the hardware. If you look at how far Star Citizen has gone and that has yet to be optimised and runs on average hardware if you don't demand the best graphics.
But you are right, they have added a ton since Skyrim, and Skyrim was very limited in what it added. What surprised me is that they claimed they had PBR in it yet I would like to know what as I couldn't see where it had been applied, but that is a good addition nonetheless.

A lot of stuff you listed would completely restrict a lot of game content and just introduce so many potential bugs. Games are already one of the most complex software to write and I'd rather have a solid well designed game play experience over a tech demo.

I don't think it would be restricting, it would simply require smarter design process rather than the standard box and corridor crawl or functional open world landscape. As for bugs, simply add a few months to test it. Bugs are a result of either bad programmers or s*** project management, but also it wouldn't be a Bethesda game if it wasn't totally bugged

 

[SPS]

I'm not sure it would be so brutal on the hardware. If you look at how far Star Citizen has gone and that has yet to be optimised and runs on average hardware if you don't demand the best graphics.
But you are right, they have added a ton since Skyrim, and Skyrim was very limited in what it added. What surprised me is that they claimed they had PBR in it yet I would like to know what as I couldn't see where it had been applied, but that is a good addition nonetheless.


I don't think it would be restricting, it would simply require smarter design process rather than the standard box and corridor crawl or functional open world landscape. As for bugs, simply add a few months to test it. Bugs are a result of either bad programmers or s*** project management, but also it wouldn't be a Bethesda game if it wasn't totally bugged

You can see differences in the metals from PBR.


Also as someone who has worked as coder on AAA games I can confirm that we spend a lot longer than a few months to test it and you'd be surprised how well designed games have to be.

 

[NeverBackDown]

I don't think it would be restricting, it would simply require smarter design process rather than the standard box and corridor crawl or functional open world landscape. As for bugs, simply add a few months to test it. Bugs are a result of either bad programmers or s*** project management, but also it wouldn't be a Bethesda game if it wasn't totally bugged

I'd like you to approach the Game Programmers, Game Engine Engineers, and the rest of the Gaming Industry, give them your credentials for credibility on the subject, tell them they suck and code like crap and should stop restricting users and start using smarter design processes, then introduce these new ideas you have to complete your dream of "total physics".. Let me know how many people laugh

 

[Jbo1234]

I'd like you to approach the Game Programmers, Game Engine Engineers, and the rest of the Gaming Industry, give them your credentials for credibility on the subject, tell them they suck and code like crap and should stop restricting users and start using smarter design processes, the introduce these new ideas you have to complete your dream of "total physics".. Let me know how many people laugh

Well with my degree and job, I probably could wrangle a project management position. Also knowing other programmers etc, you can see that some games are crippled by ineptitude at some level (normally the guys at the top not knowing what they want), but sometimes it is also the choices made by the engineers or programmers.

But all I have said is that I would like to see a bit more in the core fps element. That's not asking for the moon.

 

[Jbo1234]

Thread res

Just like to say "It's great to have been right" #smug