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AngryGoldfish
Old N Gold
This is my concern. I don't need Titan X performance. At 1440p/144Hz, a GTX 1080 is enough unless you absolutely have to play all modern titles with the settings cranked (and even that isn't possible with a Titan XP). I'm quite contented to turn a few settings down to maintain 90 FPS, my preferred sweet spot. Therefore I want a product that is well priced, has intelligent and useful features, supports the industry, is well-rounded, etc. But not everyone else sees it that way. They'll see Nvidia ruling the roost and allow that authority to trickle down to the 1070 vs Vega 11, 1060 vs RX 480, and so on.
Excalabur50
Well-known member
Microsoft to use ARM instead of Intel
SEATTLE, March 9 — Microsoft Corp is committing to use chips based on ARM Holdings Plc technology in the machinesthat run its cloud services, potentially imperilling Intel Corp’s longtime dominance in the profitable market for data-centre processors.
Microsoft has developed a version of its Windows operating system for servers using ARM processors, working with Qualcomm Inc and Cavium Inc.
The software maker is now testing these chips for tasks like search, storage, machine learning and big data, said Jason Zander, vice president of Microsoft’s Azure cloud division.
The company isn’t yet running the processors — known for being more power-efficient and offering more choice in vendors— in any customer-facing networks, and wouldn’t specifyhow widespread they eventually will be.
“It’s not deployed into production yet, but that is the next logical step,” Zander said in an interview. “This is a significant commitment on behalf of Microsoft. We wouldn’t even bring something to a conference if we didn’t think this was a committed project and something that’s part of our road map.”
Microsoft is planning to incorporatethe ARM chips as it develops a new cloud server design, which it will discuss yesterday at the Open Compute Project Summit in Santa Clara, California.
The company is announcing new partners and components for the design, first unveiled last year, as it moves closer to putting the machines into its own data centres later this year. Because the design is open-source, meaning it’s freely available to be used and customized, other companies are also likely to use variations.
Both the server design, called Project Olympus, and Microsoft’s work with ARM-based processors reflect the software maker’s push to use hardware innovations to cut costs, boost flexibility and stay competitive with Amazon.com Inc and Alphabet Inc’s Google, which also provide computing power, software and storage via the Internet.
While large cloud companies have moved toward greater use of unbrandedservers, storage and networking gear, Intel chips have remained one of the sole big-name products widely in use. Microsoft’s work with ARM, in progress for several years, could pave the way for a real challenge to Intel, which controls more than 99 per cent of the market for server chips.
While Intel is among companies making components to work with the Project Olympus design, ARM-chip makers such as Qualcomm and Cavium are also in the running, increasing the chancethat other server customers will begin to use these processors. ARM, which licences its chip designs to manufacturers, is owned by Japan’s Softbank Group Corp.
Any challengeto Intel’s dominance in server chips is a threat to its most profitable business and main revenue driver as demand for PC processors continues to shrink.
The company’s Data Centre Group turned US$17.2 billion (RM76.6 billion) of sales into US$7.5 billion of operating profit in 2016, and Intel has been running adsthat say,”98 per cent of the cloud runs on Intel.”
Microsoft’s server spending decisions have the potential to impact suppliers’ bottom lines — its Azure service is No. 2 in cloud infrastructure behind Amazon, and it’s one of the biggest server buyers.
Last month, computer maker Hewlett Packard Enterprise Co reported disappointing quarterly revenue, citing “significantly lower demand” from a major customer. That client was Microsoft, people familiar with the matter said.
This isn’t the first time ARM manufacturers have taken aim at the server market. Other chipmakers have promised computer components—based on the ARM technology that dominates in mobile phones — that would loosenIntel’s stranglehold, yet none have done so.
That may be changing this year as Qualcomm, one of the few companies that can rival Intel’s spending on research and design, begins offering its first server processor and as other chipmakers finally field long-promised chips that are capable of competing.
“This is a marathon, it’s not a sprint. I’m not starting to count the dollar bills any time soon,” said Anand Chandrasekher, a former Intel executive who heads Qualcomm’sserverchip unit. “One day in a few years we will wake up and say ‘this is pretty cool when did that happen?”
Intel expressed confidence in the continued superiority of its Xeon server chips, in a statement.
“We operate in a highly competitive market and take all competitors seriously,” the company said. “We are confident that Xeon processors will continue to deliver the highest performance and lowest total cost of ownership for our cloud customers. However, we understand the desire of our customers to evaluate other product offerings.”
Microsoft will give an update on its work on Project Olympus today in a keynote speech by Kushagra Vaid, general manager of Azure Hardware Infrastructure at Microsoft, as part of a track of sessions on the Microsoft design at the conference.
Partners including Qualcomm, Intel, Dell Technologies, Hewlett Packard Enterprise, Advanced Micro Devices Inc and Samsung Electronics Co are making chips, servers and components for use in the Microsoft design, said Vaid, who spent 11 years at Intel before joining Microsoft.
One of those planned components is an add-in box made by Microsoft and chipmaker Nvidia Corp that plugs into the server to enable powerful processing for artificial intelligence tasks. The device, which runs Nvidia’s graphics chips, lets Microsoft and other cloud providers more easily and cheaply host AI applications on their cloud networks.
For customers, the product frees them from having to invest in the computing powerneeded to perform the complex training and analysing needed for tasks like machine learning, Nvidia Chief Executive OfficerJen-Hsun Huangsaid.
“In order to use deep learning you need a supercomputer and a platform that runs any and all AI tools. Startups would rather use their money to hire people and do software development,” he said. “Now there are AI supercomputers in the cloud and you pay as you go.”
While the AI device announced yesterday was developed with Nvidia, Microsoft said future updates could add products using Intel’s Nervana chips. — Bloomberg
- See more at: http://www.themalaymailonline.com/t...ps-in-challenge-to-intel#sthash.OeUrml1O.dpuf
Courtesy of Windows News and Malaymail
SEATTLE, March 9 — Microsoft Corp is committing to use chips based on ARM Holdings Plc technology in the machinesthat run its cloud services, potentially imperilling Intel Corp’s longtime dominance in the profitable market for data-centre processors.
Microsoft has developed a version of its Windows operating system for servers using ARM processors, working with Qualcomm Inc and Cavium Inc.
The software maker is now testing these chips for tasks like search, storage, machine learning and big data, said Jason Zander, vice president of Microsoft’s Azure cloud division.
The company isn’t yet running the processors — known for being more power-efficient and offering more choice in vendors— in any customer-facing networks, and wouldn’t specifyhow widespread they eventually will be.
“It’s not deployed into production yet, but that is the next logical step,” Zander said in an interview. “This is a significant commitment on behalf of Microsoft. We wouldn’t even bring something to a conference if we didn’t think this was a committed project and something that’s part of our road map.”
Microsoft is planning to incorporatethe ARM chips as it develops a new cloud server design, which it will discuss yesterday at the Open Compute Project Summit in Santa Clara, California.
The company is announcing new partners and components for the design, first unveiled last year, as it moves closer to putting the machines into its own data centres later this year. Because the design is open-source, meaning it’s freely available to be used and customized, other companies are also likely to use variations.
Both the server design, called Project Olympus, and Microsoft’s work with ARM-based processors reflect the software maker’s push to use hardware innovations to cut costs, boost flexibility and stay competitive with Amazon.com Inc and Alphabet Inc’s Google, which also provide computing power, software and storage via the Internet.
While large cloud companies have moved toward greater use of unbrandedservers, storage and networking gear, Intel chips have remained one of the sole big-name products widely in use. Microsoft’s work with ARM, in progress for several years, could pave the way for a real challenge to Intel, which controls more than 99 per cent of the market for server chips.
While Intel is among companies making components to work with the Project Olympus design, ARM-chip makers such as Qualcomm and Cavium are also in the running, increasing the chancethat other server customers will begin to use these processors. ARM, which licences its chip designs to manufacturers, is owned by Japan’s Softbank Group Corp.
Any challengeto Intel’s dominance in server chips is a threat to its most profitable business and main revenue driver as demand for PC processors continues to shrink.
The company’s Data Centre Group turned US$17.2 billion (RM76.6 billion) of sales into US$7.5 billion of operating profit in 2016, and Intel has been running adsthat say,”98 per cent of the cloud runs on Intel.”
Microsoft’s server spending decisions have the potential to impact suppliers’ bottom lines — its Azure service is No. 2 in cloud infrastructure behind Amazon, and it’s one of the biggest server buyers.
Last month, computer maker Hewlett Packard Enterprise Co reported disappointing quarterly revenue, citing “significantly lower demand” from a major customer. That client was Microsoft, people familiar with the matter said.
This isn’t the first time ARM manufacturers have taken aim at the server market. Other chipmakers have promised computer components—based on the ARM technology that dominates in mobile phones — that would loosenIntel’s stranglehold, yet none have done so.
That may be changing this year as Qualcomm, one of the few companies that can rival Intel’s spending on research and design, begins offering its first server processor and as other chipmakers finally field long-promised chips that are capable of competing.
“This is a marathon, it’s not a sprint. I’m not starting to count the dollar bills any time soon,” said Anand Chandrasekher, a former Intel executive who heads Qualcomm’sserverchip unit. “One day in a few years we will wake up and say ‘this is pretty cool when did that happen?”
Intel expressed confidence in the continued superiority of its Xeon server chips, in a statement.
“We operate in a highly competitive market and take all competitors seriously,” the company said. “We are confident that Xeon processors will continue to deliver the highest performance and lowest total cost of ownership for our cloud customers. However, we understand the desire of our customers to evaluate other product offerings.”
Microsoft will give an update on its work on Project Olympus today in a keynote speech by Kushagra Vaid, general manager of Azure Hardware Infrastructure at Microsoft, as part of a track of sessions on the Microsoft design at the conference.
Partners including Qualcomm, Intel, Dell Technologies, Hewlett Packard Enterprise, Advanced Micro Devices Inc and Samsung Electronics Co are making chips, servers and components for use in the Microsoft design, said Vaid, who spent 11 years at Intel before joining Microsoft.
One of those planned components is an add-in box made by Microsoft and chipmaker Nvidia Corp that plugs into the server to enable powerful processing for artificial intelligence tasks. The device, which runs Nvidia’s graphics chips, lets Microsoft and other cloud providers more easily and cheaply host AI applications on their cloud networks.
For customers, the product frees them from having to invest in the computing powerneeded to perform the complex training and analysing needed for tasks like machine learning, Nvidia Chief Executive OfficerJen-Hsun Huangsaid.
“In order to use deep learning you need a supercomputer and a platform that runs any and all AI tools. Startups would rather use their money to hire people and do software development,” he said. “Now there are AI supercomputers in the cloud and you pay as you go.”
While the AI device announced yesterday was developed with Nvidia, Microsoft said future updates could add products using Intel’s Nervana chips. — Bloomberg
- See more at: http://www.themalaymailonline.com/t...ps-in-challenge-to-intel#sthash.OeUrml1O.dpuf
Courtesy of Windows News and Malaymail
Excalabur50
Well-known member
MSI GTX 1080Ti teased
https://videocardz.com/67270/msi-shows-off-geforce-gtx-1080-ti-series
Sorry bit lazy but the site is videocardz and shows all of MSI's offerings
https://videocardz.com/67270/msi-shows-off-geforce-gtx-1080-ti-series
Sorry bit lazy but the site is videocardz and shows all of MSI's offerings
Excalabur50
Well-known member
Remember support stops for Windows Vista from tomorrow
WYP
News Guru
Does anyone actually have fond memories of Vista?
AlienALX
Well-known member
Sorta kinda.
I first installed it about three days after it came out. I was visiting a pal out in MD USA and he had a Dell version that worked with no serial.
I liked it (especially how it looked) but hated the sound change (from hardware to software). TBH my biggest gripe with Vista was that it was basically released three years too soon. It looked so pretty that you needed serious hardware to shift around the features ETC, and that wasn't around when it launched.
I tried to use it day to day with Media Center, but it just continued to die etc. Then I stopped using it when 7 came out and didn't use it for years.
Around three years ago I built a dell workstation and had Win 7, Vista, XP MC, Linux and so on all booting from it. I actually really liked Vista when I used it with all of the patches and packs on decent, powerful hardware.
IMO it's still probably the best looking OS Microsoft have made. It got everything about perfect, instead of this cartoon like OS we are heading into now (thanks, Apple...).
Excalabur50
Well-known member
The one feature that I really liked from Vista is the movable desktops which you can do again now with Wallpaper Engine from Steam which I think Dicey mentioned, it's really good I now have it on my Windows 10 and love it
Dicehunter
Resident Newb
WYP
News Guru
Just seen this myself, very interesting. Puts the whole "scheduling issue" rumours to bed.
Well it does and it doesnt, still the odd issue of how windows sees the cpu/s, but its more a case of how games send what to where and ignore the schedular. And although amd sort right it off, the schedular does have this wierd habit of just throwing work across to the other set of cores and forcing the core groups to talk over infinity fabric.
And its not such a bad thing if it does it once or twice, but if its doing it once or twice every few milliseconds, or its loading shared work across multiple threads that are on dif core groups ie not shared cache then thats where we see the impact.
Because remember it doesnt need to be flipping work across threads to hit the penalty, just having work thats related on dif threads that have to share data across the infinity fabric hits that brick wall too. So its as much on where games are sending work and also shed knowing to put related work on the same core group aswell as stopping the shed just randomly putting work where it wants every now and again.
it does it on intel aswell, but intel it doesnt matter because of how those work.
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WYP
News Guru
Yeah, it is still an issue, but it seems to be a game/developer issue and not a Windows 10 issue.
It seems that the speed/latency of the infinity fabric is a real issue for Ryzen, which really explains why Ryzen is benefiting from faster memory (as the fabric speeds are linked to DDR RAM speeds). This explains why some games are benefiting from faster memory. That being said, this is not the major issue that some are making it out to be.
Hopefully, developers will quickly react to this information and ensure that future games/programs will access Ryzen's resources properly, though there seems to be real merit to the analogy that Ryzen acts like a dual-socket 2x4-core rather than a traditional 8-core.
(This is conjecture based on incomplete information, hopefully this will all be clarified in time)
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NeverBackDown
AMD Enthusiast
We don't know what effect the fabric is having yet. You shouldn't be claiming anything until we have concrete information (given your position). You shouldn't say it effects games, there is little way of knowing but yet in multi threaded application it dominates Intel. So it isn't an issue. Really just not a lot to go off of
AngryGoldfish
Old N Gold
I don't think there is anything wrong with making educated guesses in a somewhat tangential manner.
NeverBackDown
AMD Enthusiast
It's not really educated though it's all speculation. The person who made these discoveries over at Pcper doesn't even know the whole story other than there is some latency between CCX modules. That was the only data he can prove. Everything else is just what people may think but really only CPU architects would know the whole issue and Devs would know it's implications for what it means to program for. Like I said, not a lot to guess about until we get some Dev who can explain what's going on, if there is an issue or if it is just that they optimize for Intel so they just need to add Zen or whatever
PCper were honest about that though. It's all speculation at this point, but personally I find it very interesting speculation. This CPU fascinates me, and makes me want to learn more about Intel's core architecture for comparisons sake. It won't change any purchasing decisions for me since I'm going Ryzen for sure in the near future, once the memory stuff gets sorted out.
Just a note, when we are talking about ryzen it is so we can better understand it, might not make a nats balls difference to performance going forwards but when its discussed if we can better understand ryzen then we can make better discussion on it.
And its not just pcper who have looked into this, they have done it on the windows side, but wendell as a good example has looked into it from the linux side of things, and the guy knows what he is talking about and he is the one who picked up on the fact ram speed and infinity fabric has some promise.
So its not so much speculation of what could be, its more understanding why it does what it does and how different things effect it that could help people when purchasing parts for there build. The more informed you are then the better place you are in when deciding what to buy.
And its not just pcper who have looked into this, they have done it on the windows side, but wendell as a good example has looked into it from the linux side of things, and the guy knows what he is talking about and he is the one who picked up on the fact ram speed and infinity fabric has some promise.
So its not so much speculation of what could be, its more understanding why it does what it does and how different things effect it that could help people when purchasing parts for there build. The more informed you are then the better place you are in when deciding what to buy.
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