British justice, yeah right..

fruityness

New member
Not long after posting another thread, about a father who raped his own children getting a pathetic sentence, I wonder across another case, of low life scum getting a slap on the wrists. Source from BBCs website.

An illiterate teenager who was convicted of stabbing a boy to death at a house party in Manchester has been given a life sentence. Shane Boyd, 16, will serve at least 11 years for murdering Conor Black in an argument over a Xbox games console. Conor, also aged 16, collapsed and died minutes after being stabbed outside the house in Moston last August.

Boyd, who boasted that he was "the man" after the attack, was found guilty at Manchester Crown Court last month. Judge Clement Goldstone QC sentenced him to life, to serve a minimum of 11 years before he can be considered for parole. Boyd had admitted manslaughter but his plea was rejected by the court.

The court heard Boyd confronted Conor outside a house party in the early hours of 16 August over the alleged theft of an Xbox console. Boyd came out of the house and smashed his victim over the head with a can of lager, before stabbing him in the back as he turned to escape, the jury heard. Conor ran a short distance to a grassy area where he collapsed and died. The court heard Boyd then stood in the road shouting that he "was the best", he "was the man" - before threatening to kill anyone who mentioned his name to police.

Judge Goldstone said: "You had already armed yourself with a knife. "Having seen him you asked someone for a beer can with which you hit him over the head and after he was walking away from you in something of a daze, posing no threat to you, you stabbed him once in the back. "Your initial response was to gloat and to boast to anyone who would be impressed by what you had done."

Shane Boyd will serve at least 11 years of his sentence.

After the sentencing Conor's family released a statement through Greater Manchester Police saying they were devastated by his death. "All the hopes and dreams of a family were crushed when Conor's life was stolen in that terrible, violent way," it said. "His mum lost her friend, her child, her life and that makes us so very sad and helpless."

Det Ch Insp Serena Kennedy, of Greater Manchester Police, said Conor's death had shown the devastating impact knives could have. "One boy's family is grieving the loss of his life, and today the defendant, himself a boy, will start spending his life in prison," she said.

Boyd's cousin, John Boyd, 20, of the same address, was sentenced to three years in a young offenders' institution for assault and perverting the course of justice. The court heard that he threatened a 16-year-old witness he mistakenly believed had told police that Shane Boyd was a murderer.


How the hell can anyone get a life sentence and then have the chance to be on parole in 11 years? A defender of the 'justice system' may point out the chances of him getting out in 11 yeras would be slim, my retort would be why the hell is he getting the chance to be released at all!!

I find these cases incredible, the family of Conor will spend the rest of their lives in anguish over this, a life taken for nothing, and he may be out in 11 years? How the hell is that justice?

This filth / scum / piece of crap murderer, will goto jail, and just be hardened into criminal activity, if he were to come out in 11 years, or 50 years, he wont be contributing on any meaningful level. Yet we'll release this sociopath at some stage to integrate back into society? A piece of crap human who thinks its ok to smash someone over the head, then stab them in the back as they try to flee.

Way to go British Justice.

Fruityness` way to deal with these types? Lock them up forever. Period. And that's just the minimum. I'm an eye for an eye kind of person, let's take the buggers life, see how he likes the feeling of knowing he'll be dead soon like he forced another to go through. And before some bible-type-basher says "So you'd leave the whole world blind". No, just the filth who make what should be Utopia, hell for some.

</end rant>

:mad:
 
i agree with you, this is totally wrong! life should mean life. Cant help but think that if the prisons wasnt so crowded, people would be getting longer (and correct) sentances.

didnt we used to ship all these people to new zealand, cant we start that up again :p
 
I agree, and we should also have the 3 strikes system used in some states in the US. If someone commits 3 serious charges then they should be given life. That would put an end to the career criminals. Regards prisons running out of space, there's not an easy answer to that. The more prisoners we have, the more prison guards, space and money we need. Adding to the population that is already at bursting point would cause more problems and could cause more dangers to the public and prison staff. It's a catch 22 situation.
 
I can solve the prison problem,THere are plenty of islands around Scotland,just ship them up there and let them fend for themselves
 
Always makes me think of Bill Hicks "Well we didn't lose a cure for cancer".

I've always been of the "up against the wall" brigade. Punishment should be exactly that. I appreciate that, in these modern enlightened times, nobody would want a repeat of the "give it to him" incident, but then with DNA testing we can almost wholly eliminate that problem. At the very least we should give the convicted a choice of x years in prison or execution.

But then most of us become less understanding the older we become. It's not "larks", it's not "awww the poor deprived urchin", it's words I'm not allowed to use on this forum.
 
In my opinion if it's proven someone has murder'd someone delibratley in cold blood, then the offender should be given a death penalty, rather than the governmant (more like us) paying for them to be looked after in prison and taking up prison space, which we have little off, what on earth are we keeping murderers and psychos for!!!????

I feel the most likely would reduce the likelyhood of such things happening.

Bring back the death penalty
 
p.s and for the prison over population problem... for people convicted of worser crimes throw em all in a cell together why should they have special treatment?
 
My opinion, you may not necessarily agree with me;

I think giving the boy a life sentence would not be the most appropriate thing. Always remember, the prison system is not just for punishment, but it is also for rehabilitation. Lets look at the facts. He killed his "friend" over a video game issue. This does not mean that he is a cold blooded killer or something along those lines. What happens when you have 200/10 in a game of counter strike? Personally I go out yelling I AM the MAN.

I am not saying that it is justified what this boy did, and I am also not blaming video games for his actions. However, considering the fact that this boy is a minor, and the fact that he has his whole life ahead of him, giving him a second chance to feel remorse for what he has done, and rehabilitation shouldn't be completely out of the question, can it?

-HypoG
 
name='HypoglossalXII' said:
My opinion, you may not necessarily agree with me;

I think giving the boy a life sentence would not be the most appropriate thing. Always remember, the prison system is not just for punishment, but it is also for rehabilitation. Lets look at the facts. He killed his "friend" over a video game issue. This does not mean that he is a cold blooded killer or something along those lines. What happens when you have 200/10 in a game of counter strike? Personally I go out yelling I AM the MAN.

I am not saying that it is justified what this boy did, and I am also not blaming video games for his actions. However, considering the fact that this boy is a minor, and the fact that he has his whole life ahead of him, giving him a second chance to feel remorse for what he has done, and rehabilitation shouldn't be completely out of the question, can it?

-HypoG

But then that could go either way. He might regret what he done, or he might think it was "fun" and then join a gang and express his "feelings". But I see what you mean HypoG.
 
name='HypoglossalXII' said:
My opinion, you may not necessarily agree with me;

I think giving the boy a life sentence would not be the most appropriate thing. Always remember, the prison system is not just for punishment, but it is also for rehabilitation. Lets look at the facts. He killed his "friend" over a video game issue. This does not mean that he is a cold blooded killer or something along those lines. What happens when you have 200/10 in a game of counter strike? Personally I go out yelling I AM the MAN.

I am not saying that it is justified what this boy did, and I am also not blaming video games for his actions. However, considering the fact that this boy is a minor, and the fact that he has his whole life ahead of him, giving him a second chance to feel remorse for what he has done, and rehabilitation shouldn't be completely out of the question, can it?

-HypoG

but what if you give him a second chance and he goes out and does it again. Is it worth taking the risk of something losing a loved one for a killer?
 
name='HypoglossalXII' said:
My opinion, you may not necessarily agree with me;

I think giving the boy a life sentence would not be the most appropriate thing. Always remember, the prison system is not just for punishment, but it is also for rehabilitation. Lets look at the facts. He killed his "friend" over a video game issue. This does not mean that he is a cold blooded killer or something along those lines. What happens when you have 200/10 in a game of counter strike? Personally I go out yelling I AM the MAN.

I am not saying that it is justified what this boy did, and I am also not blaming video games for his actions. However, considering the fact that this boy is a minor, and the fact that he has his whole life ahead of him, giving him a second chance to feel remorse for what he has done, and rehabilitation shouldn't be completely out of the question, can it?

-HypoG

To say that prison rehabilitaes anyone is a joke, look at all the career criminals you often hear about? Sent to prison 20 times, criminal record longer than both arms. Prison doesnt work. If this murderer was taken out of prison, given daily councelling, guidance, and had a bunch of flower arrangers and tree huggers round him, maybe, just maybe, he'd change. But surround him with other killers, rapists, bank robbers drug dealers... No chance. If he comes out in 5 years or in 50 the mere process of the prison system will make him less able to cope with real world social interactions, and look what he's like already, thinks it's a-ok to stick a knife into someone.

I've often read articles or seen documentaries where long term prisoners get released, and the first thing they do it commit a crime and get caught intentionally so they can be returned to prison, as they just cant cope with life outside, without the scrict regime dictating how they should do things.

Really, anyone who thinks its ok to be that violent, where there is no accident type situation involved, where it's totally deliberate, to stab, shoot, severly beat up - just take them outside and shoot them. They should have no place in this society.

Of course we cant do that, the EU :crazy: says we cant even debate the death penalty. So all we are left with is locking up the scum. And I know this for an irrefutable fact, you release this murderer, he may well kill again, you leave him locked up forever, he wont be harming any law abiding citizen.
 
name='nathan' said:
i agree with you, this is totally wrong! life should mean life. Cant help but think that if the prisons wasnt so crowded, people would be getting longer (and correct) sentances.

didnt we used to ship all these people to new zealand, cant we start that up again :p

Erm that was Australia dude. Mother England shipped her worst out here on the 'First Fleet' which contained 11 ships and some 1370 odd convicts on 13 May 1787 to establish the first European colony in New South Wales.

Regarding the 11 year sentence handed to this offender, I too am appalled. 11 years is hardly a representation of someone's life - a life sentence should be for the term of one's natural life without possibility of parole.
 
*sighs* I should leave this alone but no....

First 'The EU says we can't even debate the death penalty' isn't exactly true.

Article 2 ECHR (Right to Life) is appplied through S.6 HRA. European jurisprudence has ruled on Death Penalty issues citing the margin of appreciation. Essentially, it's a matter which it is acceptable for a member state to have a independant policy given it's justified, within a range of circumstances. I'd cite sources but my PC isn't booting - but look at ECHR guidance and big cases like McCann etc and the rules on margin of appreciation for non-derrogable duties.

AS for punishment? WEll, its an issue for the govt - they issue sentencing guidelines. Thats an issue re; seperation of powers in itself.

AS to the specifics of the case - you dont know them. I've seen cases of a mentally ill teenager defend himself from attackers and be called 'murderous scum' by the tabloids - check ballii and times law reports if you want the facts.

The point is that law is a slow and considered process. Familys dont get to decide punishments, nor does the newspapers. There are circumstances you arent aware of, there are mitigations. Perhaps not in this case, but YOU nor I have the power to judge someone. We an old and very carefully refined system in place.

The idea of a jury trial, of discovery, of Article 6, of limitations on press reporting, on jury direction, on expensive defence barristers, of nearly everything we do is that perhaps, with as far as we've come as a civilisation, we want to aspire to something higher than the mob, baying for blood.

Just my opinion.
 
name='PV5150' said:
Erm that was Australia dude. Mother England shipped her worst out here on the 'First Fleet' which contained 11 ships and some 1370 odd convicts on 13 May 1787 to establish the first European colony in New South Wales.

Regarding the 11 year sentence handed to this offender, I too am appalled. 11 years is hardly a representation of someone's life - a life sentence should be for the term of one's natural life without possibility of parole.

just goes to show how well i did in history at school! although im fairly sure i seen billy connerly touring NZ and said something about it.
 
name='nepas' said:
I can solve the prison problem,THere are plenty of islands around Scotland,just ship them up there and let them fend for themselves

Sounds fair enough.

Patrol the islands (otherwize some villian will lift them off), use them for navy training and special forces stuff (landings and sneak attacks).

I don't personally want to spend cash housing them in a prison with their playstations, holidays, schooling, degree courses.

Life should mean life - the scumbag here is going to be release with a big chance of a full education. Not do a snout of work for it either.

Charge the parents I would.
 
name='Rastalovich' said:
Charge the parents I would.

Now that my friend is genuine bs right there.

Were your parents responsible for everything you did until you were 18 or did you think that, as a self-contained human being, you had some freedom of choice?

The best you can do as a parent is teach them proper values, ethics and morals, then hope they apply them as best as they can. If they then decide that what they really want to do is drink and drive, or hide smarties in a raincoat, or stab someone because they looked at them wierdly, that's not really the parents fault.
 
name='sjek' said:
*sighs* I should leave this alone but no....

First 'The EU says we can't even debate the death penalty' isn't exactly true.

Charter of fundamental human rights (EU) clearly states;

No one shall be condemned to the death penalty, or executed.

Though there may be a provision for times of war.

You cant debate the death penalty, because its been written into EU law that you cant execute people, and EU law is beyond the power of any one government. So why debate it? Any result is meaningless.

So you may aswell try and gather water in a sieve.

Also, I or anyone else here doesnt need to know specifics of the case, they can read what the judge in the case say happened, and go from there. And beyond this, on a real fundamental level, it's unacceptable to take another life in this unprovoked way, it was over an XBox game/console , how on earth can you say "you know nothing about the case", what I know is a young kid is dead because of sociopathic murderer who's happy to stab people and shout out about it, all over a ****ty games console.

Go sit with the family of Conor and tell them how perfect and balanced the British / EU system of "justice" is. In 10 years when we have long long forgotten this, they'll still be remembering.
 
Yes I agree, a family has lost there child to a psychopath, no excuse is good enough for this kind of murder end of story,

problem is this world has become way to soft and many western countrys have become way too bothered about being ''politicaly correct''

It does nobody but the offenders good...

You take a life like this you shoudl lose your own right to live!

name='fruityness' said:
Charter of fundamental human rights (EU) clearly states;

No one shall be condemned to the death penalty, or executed.

Though there may be a provision for times of war.

You cant debate the death penalty, because its been written into EU law that you cant execute people, and EU law is beyond the power of any one government. So why debate it? Any result is meaningless.

So you may aswell try and gather water in a sieve.

Also, I or anyone else here doesnt need to know specifics of the case, they can read what the judge in the case say happened, and go from there. And beyond this, on a real fundamental level, it's unacceptable to take another life in this unprovoked way, it was over an XBox game/console , how on earth can you say "you know nothing about the case", what I know is a young kid is dead because of sociopathic murderer who's happy to stab people and shout out about it, all over a ****ty games console.

Go sit with the family of Conor and tell them how perfect and balanced the British / EU system of "justice" is. In 10 years when we have long long forgotten this, they'll still be remembering.
 
There will never be a perfect form of punishment in life. But say the death penalty did exist then each and every homocide punishment should be thoroughly investigated. Now even though certain things are taken into account during court already, they should find out still find out whether that person has potential in life. E.g. 2 people in court. Same charges but one was/is good in school and could potentially have a good future while the other fails/failed in life and doesn't seem to be able to have a good future and will continue breaking the law. In that case, the second person should face a much worser punishment then the first.

Oh God typing on the wii sucks.
 
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