Win8 looks crap?
- Thread starter Lollipop
- Start date
dugdiamond
New member
games for XBLIG (xbox live indie games) using XNA are normally ported to the 360, via .NET, using ~80% of the same code as if it was for the PC. (pragma statements used during compile for target)
win8 will have the code for XNA5 (yes, xnaFIVE - currently XNA4 is used for PC, console and phone) natively, so XBLIG devs can code for the PC and it will run EXACTLY (as is - without port pragmas) on the the xbox360, and vice-versa.
someone has started leaking this info and has got it wrong - very wrong - lol
alienware
Banned
It's all over the net man. Microsoft haven't come out with a statement to say it isn't happening either.
Think about it like this, if you will.
Firstly they can and will then do what they tried to do with GFWL. IE - charge you a sub. Thankfully due to Steam people just told them to bugger off, so they made it free. They then went ahead and made sure that you pretty much had to buy a 360 controller to play any new game. Now I did try using Xpadder but it suffered with lag. Yes yes, before any one says it pads are poo on a PC and shouldn't be used. However.
Firstly Fallout 3 and New Vegas use the pad. Aiming isn't crucial because the aiming in "free shooting" is terrible. You need to use V.A.T.S. And due to the amount of time I spend playing it (believe me, it's a lot. I'm on playthrough 4 on NV and it's taken me 55 hours. My first couple took double that). I have put over the past threeish years about 600 hours into Fallout 3. Playing with a controller means I can sit back and get comfortable, rather than being crabbed over a desk. It also means that I can actually play Nfenix on my 42" plasma which doesn't have the option of using KBM and is mostly used for racing games which suck on KBM.
However, 360 controllers (whilst I admit are the best controllers I've ever used, sturdy, quality and comfy) are, or were, expensive. Mine, wired, cost me £35.
Moving on. This isn't exciting at all. It can, and probably will, be the beginning of the end for PC gaming. I guess you would need to know Microsoft's motives and if you weren't completely aware I will divulge the info (true genuine info) into their motives. Please consider the following before you get all excited.
1. They charge a whopping license fee for some one to publish a game for their system. You're not even allowed to release a wet fart without paying to do so. It's similar, only worse, to how the PSX worked. You buy a blue PSX for about £800 and then you can code games for it !. And then you can pay Sony to publish them.
2. Microsoft, BY LAW, can not charge a licensing fee for a game that is released on the PC. Open dev or something, they tried it but lost in court. Certain parts of Windows are to remain open for coders to code what they like and Microsoft are not allowed to stop you. Once complete and as long as it's all your code you can then sell it, Indie titles such as world of goo making quite a few bob for the person who creates them.
3. Microsoft have publically stated (by their head CEO for Europe) that, quote - Having the same game released simultaneously on two formats is not in our best interests. Which of course, it isn't. They can't charge a licensing fee for a PC game. This is why PC games are so much cheaper. For example the forthcoming Dead Island is £40 on console, £26 delivered on PC. So let's assume for a moment that they get around £15 per license per game. If you wanted factual evidence to back this up then please see - Alan Wake. This was originally WIPed as a PC game, then all of a sudden dissapeared off the map. They will do this, as they see fit, with any game they feel will sell in mass numbers on a certain format.
4. They are leaning, quite heavily, on smaller coders. Let's take Street Fighter IV and SSFIV for example. Both tool forever to come to PC and by time they did they were old news and old hat. Mortal Kombat is another recent example, slated only for a "possible future release".
5. Microsoft have in the past fragrantly broken the law with Windows. As an older example (because I CBA digging newer lawsuits up) on Windows 98 FE you installed the OS then reached a part where it tried to force you onto their dial up internet. If you didn't? you could not get past it and pretty much could not use the internet AT ALL if you refused to use their service. They were taken to court for this, and lost. They were then being charged something like $300,000 PER DAY that they refused to comply. (statistics and figures are not accurate but off the top of my head). However, these fines were far less than what they were actually making, so they just continued to pay them. They were taken back to court again, this time forced to back down and hence, Windows 98 SE. There is nothing you can not put past them, given that they are one of the richest corporations on earth.
6. They will quite happily kill PC gaming and not care. This means there is no point in even owning a fast gaming PC. All of that expensive powerful hardware you bought would be rendered useless overnight if this was to happen. It would be far easier for the lazy coders to get their game out, hence, paying the licensing fee would probably work out cheaper than spending a fair chunk of time getting the game to work across multiple hardware differences worthwhile. This would mean cack graphics and the basically rather crap console ports we have now. However, Microsoft would then quite gleefully put up the licensing costs seeing as they would then have more to maintain. Your online gaming would certainly NOT remain free.
So make of that what you will I guess. Protection would be easy, considering that they can kill Xboxes with a ban wave very easily. Not that they could physically kill your hardware of course (or render it useless) but simply ban your IP address.
Food for thought.
Think about it like this, if you will.
Firstly they can and will then do what they tried to do with GFWL. IE - charge you a sub. Thankfully due to Steam people just told them to bugger off, so they made it free. They then went ahead and made sure that you pretty much had to buy a 360 controller to play any new game. Now I did try using Xpadder but it suffered with lag. Yes yes, before any one says it pads are poo on a PC and shouldn't be used. However.
Firstly Fallout 3 and New Vegas use the pad. Aiming isn't crucial because the aiming in "free shooting" is terrible. You need to use V.A.T.S. And due to the amount of time I spend playing it (believe me, it's a lot. I'm on playthrough 4 on NV and it's taken me 55 hours. My first couple took double that). I have put over the past threeish years about 600 hours into Fallout 3. Playing with a controller means I can sit back and get comfortable, rather than being crabbed over a desk. It also means that I can actually play Nfenix on my 42" plasma which doesn't have the option of using KBM and is mostly used for racing games which suck on KBM.
However, 360 controllers (whilst I admit are the best controllers I've ever used, sturdy, quality and comfy) are, or were, expensive. Mine, wired, cost me £35.
Moving on. This isn't exciting at all. It can, and probably will, be the beginning of the end for PC gaming. I guess you would need to know Microsoft's motives and if you weren't completely aware I will divulge the info (true genuine info) into their motives. Please consider the following before you get all excited.
1. They charge a whopping license fee for some one to publish a game for their system. You're not even allowed to release a wet fart without paying to do so. It's similar, only worse, to how the PSX worked. You buy a blue PSX for about £800 and then you can code games for it !. And then you can pay Sony to publish them.
2. Microsoft, BY LAW, can not charge a licensing fee for a game that is released on the PC. Open dev or something, they tried it but lost in court. Certain parts of Windows are to remain open for coders to code what they like and Microsoft are not allowed to stop you. Once complete and as long as it's all your code you can then sell it, Indie titles such as world of goo making quite a few bob for the person who creates them.
3. Microsoft have publically stated (by their head CEO for Europe) that, quote - Having the same game released simultaneously on two formats is not in our best interests. Which of course, it isn't. They can't charge a licensing fee for a PC game. This is why PC games are so much cheaper. For example the forthcoming Dead Island is £40 on console, £26 delivered on PC. So let's assume for a moment that they get around £15 per license per game. If you wanted factual evidence to back this up then please see - Alan Wake. This was originally WIPed as a PC game, then all of a sudden dissapeared off the map. They will do this, as they see fit, with any game they feel will sell in mass numbers on a certain format.
4. They are leaning, quite heavily, on smaller coders. Let's take Street Fighter IV and SSFIV for example. Both tool forever to come to PC and by time they did they were old news and old hat. Mortal Kombat is another recent example, slated only for a "possible future release".
5. Microsoft have in the past fragrantly broken the law with Windows. As an older example (because I CBA digging newer lawsuits up) on Windows 98 FE you installed the OS then reached a part where it tried to force you onto their dial up internet. If you didn't? you could not get past it and pretty much could not use the internet AT ALL if you refused to use their service. They were taken to court for this, and lost. They were then being charged something like $300,000 PER DAY that they refused to comply. (statistics and figures are not accurate but off the top of my head). However, these fines were far less than what they were actually making, so they just continued to pay them. They were taken back to court again, this time forced to back down and hence, Windows 98 SE. There is nothing you can not put past them, given that they are one of the richest corporations on earth.
6. They will quite happily kill PC gaming and not care. This means there is no point in even owning a fast gaming PC. All of that expensive powerful hardware you bought would be rendered useless overnight if this was to happen. It would be far easier for the lazy coders to get their game out, hence, paying the licensing fee would probably work out cheaper than spending a fair chunk of time getting the game to work across multiple hardware differences worthwhile. This would mean cack graphics and the basically rather crap console ports we have now. However, Microsoft would then quite gleefully put up the licensing costs seeing as they would then have more to maintain. Your online gaming would certainly NOT remain free.
So make of that what you will I guess. Protection would be easy, considering that they can kill Xboxes with a ban wave very easily. Not that they could physically kill your hardware of course (or render it useless) but simply ban your IP address.
Food for thought.
alienware
Banned
Well come on dude. This is Microsoft we are talking about here. They're hardly squeaky clean !.
IIRC the whole open source thing was down to them pretty much stealing large portions of code for DOS. Again, lawsuit.
It's fine if you're a console owner (well, maybe not as it won't change much) but as discussed in the other thread about that auctioning thing they will always be looking for ways to screw more money out of people.
PC owners are the blight of their cause. We get to play online, on dedicated servers, for nothing !. Imagine how much that must sting a company who charge whatever they do monthly for the privelige of XBL !.
Even EA have plenty of hidden crap in their agenda. Most notably the ruling they passed on MW2. "We are at will to pull our online gaming servers as and when we see fit". Which basically translates into "We will pull our gaming servers on older games to force people into buying the new one to play online."
They have also made it so that you can not use your own servers to play said game. Valve do that part brilliantly leaving their games wide open to use third party servers.
Edit. here we go guys. One example..
United States vs. Microsoft was a set of civil actions filed against Microsoft Corporation pursuant to the Clayton Act, 1913 Section 3 on May 18, 1998 by the United States Department of Justice (DOJ) and 20 U.S. states. Joel I. Klein was the lead prosecutor. The plaintiffs alleged that Microsoft abused monopoly power on Intel-based personal computers in its handling of operating system sales and web browser sales.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft
They also got into trouble with Win XP, and again, fined. Basically they incorporated their MSN browser and MSN messenger into it. However, you could not uninstall them. You were lumped with both until they were forced into court and released a patch to let you uninstall them.
This is basically why Windows 7 comes up with that browser choice thing when you first boot it up, to avoid them being dragged into court again.
The most recent one I can recall is a Windows Update that was hidden in the "Important Updates". It made no mention of what it specifically did, however, once installed it would sniff for loaders and disable them. Now of course it's fine to want to stop piracy of your operating system, but to sneak a file onto some one's computer without letting on what it does is clearly illegal.
http://geekmontage.com/how-to-uninstall-windows-7-activation-update-kb971033/
For those of you who installed the Microsoft Windows 7 Activation Checker update (KB971033) you can still uninstall it. The reason that viewers such as you may want to uninstall it, is because of the surround rumors that this update creates a new process/service that will slow down your system and has been rumored to monitor the user. If you haven't installed this, you can hide and prevent the Microsoft Windows Update Windows Activation Checker (KB971033) from installing by using the directions below.
Ooo and another one I forgot !
Starforce and Securom. Both labelled as "DRM". However, both were small pieces of code that were shoved into your computer and hidden away. Once there, at the beginning, you could not remove them. Again this was taken to court as an abuse of people's privacy and again they lost, forcing the companies using it to create a removal tool that removed it from your system.
There is an ongoing battle now to stop cookie sniffing and targetted adverts. They basically work by tracking your internet use and then firing erm "suitable" adverts at you. Example. If I went to Google and typed in Alienware and then went to say, Ebay, I would then see Alienwares being recommended to me and shoved in my face. Ah yes, here we go. Earlier I went on Ebay looking at Alienware parts. Lo and behold ! I go to Gumtree and -
IIRC the whole open source thing was down to them pretty much stealing large portions of code for DOS. Again, lawsuit.
It's fine if you're a console owner (well, maybe not as it won't change much) but as discussed in the other thread about that auctioning thing they will always be looking for ways to screw more money out of people.
PC owners are the blight of their cause. We get to play online, on dedicated servers, for nothing !. Imagine how much that must sting a company who charge whatever they do monthly for the privelige of XBL !.
Even EA have plenty of hidden crap in their agenda. Most notably the ruling they passed on MW2. "We are at will to pull our online gaming servers as and when we see fit". Which basically translates into "We will pull our gaming servers on older games to force people into buying the new one to play online."
They have also made it so that you can not use your own servers to play said game. Valve do that part brilliantly leaving their games wide open to use third party servers.
Edit. here we go guys. One example..
United States vs. Microsoft was a set of civil actions filed against Microsoft Corporation pursuant to the Clayton Act, 1913 Section 3 on May 18, 1998 by the United States Department of Justice (DOJ) and 20 U.S. states. Joel I. Klein was the lead prosecutor. The plaintiffs alleged that Microsoft abused monopoly power on Intel-based personal computers in its handling of operating system sales and web browser sales.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft
They also got into trouble with Win XP, and again, fined. Basically they incorporated their MSN browser and MSN messenger into it. However, you could not uninstall them. You were lumped with both until they were forced into court and released a patch to let you uninstall them.
This is basically why Windows 7 comes up with that browser choice thing when you first boot it up, to avoid them being dragged into court again.
The most recent one I can recall is a Windows Update that was hidden in the "Important Updates". It made no mention of what it specifically did, however, once installed it would sniff for loaders and disable them. Now of course it's fine to want to stop piracy of your operating system, but to sneak a file onto some one's computer without letting on what it does is clearly illegal.
http://geekmontage.com/how-to-uninstall-windows-7-activation-update-kb971033/
For those of you who installed the Microsoft Windows 7 Activation Checker update (KB971033) you can still uninstall it. The reason that viewers such as you may want to uninstall it, is because of the surround rumors that this update creates a new process/service that will slow down your system and has been rumored to monitor the user. If you haven't installed this, you can hide and prevent the Microsoft Windows Update Windows Activation Checker (KB971033) from installing by using the directions below.
Ooo and another one I forgot !
Starforce and Securom. Both labelled as "DRM". However, both were small pieces of code that were shoved into your computer and hidden away. Once there, at the beginning, you could not remove them. Again this was taken to court as an abuse of people's privacy and again they lost, forcing the companies using it to create a removal tool that removed it from your system.
There is an ongoing battle now to stop cookie sniffing and targetted adverts. They basically work by tracking your internet use and then firing erm "suitable" adverts at you. Example. If I went to Google and typed in Alienware and then went to say, Ebay, I would then see Alienwares being recommended to me and shoved in my face. Ah yes, here we go. Earlier I went on Ebay looking at Alienware parts. Lo and behold ! I go to Gumtree and -
alienware
Banned
It's Microsoft remember. They only make every other OS good
Win 7=Good
Vista=Crap
XP=Good
Millenium/2000=Crap
Win98=Good
Win95=Crap
Win 3.1=Good (well for it's time)
OUCH !
Windows 2000 was the best OS they ever released man !. It was NT with a nice new front end. LOL bit is that XP was 2000 with a new GUI
XP was the first home based OS that used NTFS. Infact, you could turn off the GUI and have Windows 2000 staring at you
Windows Multiple Errors (sniggers) was an attempt at slapping the 2000 front end on 98 and failing. They didn't want to put out a cheap NT OS at the time as that would mean businesses could then use it on account of it being cheaper. Something when badly wrong though
Vista was terrible. Correction, even with multiple service packs and fixes it's still terrible.
Lollipop - Microsoft have never been honest. Their first mainstream operating system was DOS (CMD, basically). And most of that was pinched from an early Unix OS. They were in court over that one too
Ya93sin
New member
OUCH !
Windows 2000 was the best OS they ever released man !. It was NT with a nice new front end. LOL bit is that XP was 2000 with a new GUI
XP was the first home based OS that used NTFS. Infact, you could turn off the GUI and have Windows 2000 staring at you
Windows Multiple Errors (sniggers) was an attempt at slapping the 2000 front end on 98 and failing. They didn't want to put out a cheap NT OS at the time as that would mean businesses could then use it on account of it being cheaper. Something when badly wrong though
Vista was terrible. Correction, even with multiple service packs and fixes it's still terrible.
Lollipop - Microsoft have never been honest. Their first mainstream operating system was DOS (CMD, basically). And most of that was pinched from an early Unix OS. They were in court over that one too
I actually got VIsta looking like 2000 for my grandfather, he hates/hated the Aero stuff.
Ofc now he has Windows 7 on a nice flashy Vaio laptop, but then he got a virus. He didn't even have anti-virus
Ah well, its difficult sometimes.
I remember ME, a friend had it, and I just used to laugh uncontrollably when I used it. Dodgiest thing ever, and I was what, 8 or so and I was making fun of it.
At the end of the day, many of us have been born and bred on Windows, and its what we will always use. Goddamn it, even the errors are somewhat comfortable because we all know what they mean
And if you ever have trouble, you can guarantee there are 2000 identical posts with the same issue out on the net.
SmoulderingCircuits
New member
If you are talking about this, then imo no. I think is a FAR improvement over what we have now. I like simplicity, yet i program Microsoft go figure.
It looks a mess:
ITEM A IT'S SO AMAZING DRAMATIC TILE DEDICATED
ITEM B IT'S SO AMAZING DRAMATIC TILE DEDICATED
ITEM C IT'S SO AMAZING DRAMATIC TILE DEDICATED . . .
Unlinke the current, neat, orderly:
Here is your filing cabinet, choose the drawer you wish to open
Linux will slay the monster, with it's own more efficient verion of DX and OpenGL, making M$ and their army of evil coders like EA fall flat on their faces as Linux games will have better graphics and acheive higher fps because they have been coded properly as opposed to the equivilant console style games from console whore devs that run 70% lower fps and put hardware under needless load
Ya93sin
New member
That's the thing, Linux is way more efficient in the way it uses everything. And its reliable too, I've never had a Linux crash in the last 2 years. But the trick is gettign DirectX going, I mean Wine is hardly good for a majority of games unless you have nice hardware.
He had too much prons on his PC ahah
FunkyMonkey90
New member
If you have been reading this thread then you would have realised that's just a start screen and that you can go straight to your desktop as normal from it. Next time you want to comment on a thread don't just read the first 3 posts
Has anyone got the W8 Beta? I've seen a few copies floating about on the internet but my internet is to slow to download =[.
SmoulderingCircuits
New member
That's the thing, Linux is way more efficient in the way it uses everything. And its reliable too, I've never had a Linux crash in the last 2 years. But the trick is gettign DirectX going, I mean Wine is hardly good for a majority of games unless you have nice hardware.
He had too much prons on his PC ahah
The only reason I still use Windows
SmoulderingCircuits
New member
If you have been reading this thread then you would have realised that's just a start screen and that you can go straight to your desktop as normal from it. Next time you want to comment on a thread don't just read the first 3 posts
Has anyone got the W8 Beta? I've seen a few copies floating about on the internet but my internet is to slow to download =[.
I did read the whole thread *seethes*
It still looks messy whatever it is. And why would anyone want to upgrade when there is no DX12 yet exclusive to it and the interface is samey or worse. I think a lot of us will be sticking with 7
It's Microsoft remember. They only make every other OS good
Win 7=Good
Vista=Crap
XP=Good
Millenium/2000=Crap
Win98=Good
Win95=Crap
Win 3.1=Good (well for it's time)
I like your thinking dude! you may have a pompom girl
