What PSU to buy (LGA 1151, Z170)

[DeGrab]

Hello,

I'm building a new computer from scratch. Here is almost a final version:

Intel I5 6600K (water cooling NZXT Kraken X41);
Asus Z170 Maximus VIII Ranger;
MSI R9 380 Gaming 4G;
Kingston HyperX Fury 2x 4GB 2666MHz DDR4;
1x SSD;
2x HDD;
Fractal Design Define S Window (1x front/1x rear 140mm fans).

Now my question is what PSU to get, I'm choosing between 550W or 650W (EVGA SuperNOVA 550/650 G2)?

I am planning to OC the CPU, maybe also GPU. I do not plan to CrossFire. According to some calculations 550W should be quite enough. Maybe it is a no brainer to get 650W as it is only slightly more expensive but if there's no need...

Any other suggestions regarding this setup also welcome

Thanks

 

[Arne Saknussemm]

If you are OCing CPU and GPU I would suggest 650 minimum and would say 750 better. You always want to be operating the power supply in its comfort zone not anywhere close to the edge...

I would look at something like http://http://www.seasonicusa.com/NEW_X-series_KM3_650-750-850.htm but that is personal preference...

 

[MadMarc]

If you are OCing CPU and GPU I would suggest 650 minimum and would say 750 better. You always want to be operating the power supply in its comfort zone not anywhere close to the edge...

I would look at something like http://http://www.seasonicusa.com/NEW_X-series_KM3_650-750-850.htm but that is personal preference...

550w is plenty for that rig, 750w would be stupidly overkill.

 

[Arne Saknussemm]

Your rudeness aside...no.

550 is the minimum recommend and that is stock. Start OCing and that GPU can pull 240-250W and the CPU at 4.7GHZ 130-140W without power to anything else.

The idea is not to buy the minimum if you want your PSU to last and last comfortably...

Trying to skimp on the PSU is a false economy...I would recommend to anyone that they indeed provide overkill for longevity and stability especially overclocking. Stupid would be not doing so...

 

[kiwi91]

Yes, 550 W would be enough.
Couple of reviews show that systems with R9 380 don't need more than 350 W even with more powerful CPUs.

Thinkcomputers - CPU i7-5960X @ stock?
Hardocp - i7-3770K @ 4,6 GHz
Guru3D - i7-5960X @ 4,4 GHz
eTeknix - i7-5820K @ stock

And I would say that you will hardly pass 400 W even with extreme OC.

 

[AlienALX]

550w would be 'enough' yes. What happens later when you want to add another GPU or something like that?

I think I would better understand that mentality if it wasn't just £15-£20 to get a more powerful PSU.

 

[Marc_92]

I would go with a 650w, just in case you decide to upgrade at a later date. It'll give you peace of mind not having to worry if there is enough wattage for another gpu for example.

 

[NeverBackDown]

Your rudeness aside...no.

550 is the minimum recommend and that is stock. Start OCing and that GPU can pull 240-250W and the CPU at 4.7GHZ 130-140W without power to anything else.

The idea is not to buy the minimum if you want your PSU to last and last comfortably...

Trying to skimp on the PSU is a false economy...I would recommend to anyone that they indeed provide overkill for longevity and stability especially overclocking. Stupid would be not doing so...

He wasn't being rude. He is right. 550watt is enough for his rig. If he has the budget to get a bigger unit then I'd would advise to do so if he ever plans on adding another 380. If he only plans on single GPUs then 550watts is more than enough especially as we move onto next gen GPUs which will require less power(as we jump down from 28nm).

 

[AlienALX]

He wasn't being rude. He is right. 550watt is enough for his rig. If he has the budget to get a bigger unit then I'd would advise to do so if he ever plans on adding another 380. If he only plans on single GPUs then 550watts is more than enough especially as we move onto next gen GPUs which will require less power(as we jump down from 28nm).

The problem with GPUs is that whenever they shrink the die they increase the clocks. So that means they still use loads of power and still get hot. Apparently normal temps for the 980ti are in the 80s which is no different to any GPU for the past ten years really. Even the GTX 480 could be made to run in the 80s (if you could live with the noise).

Any way I've always been of the "Min 750w" variety and have never been one to skimp on a power supply so I would go with that.

As I said before it's only £15-£20 extra, nothing in the grand scheme of things.

What if a dual CPU single PCB card comes out at a really good price? you'd be a bit snookered.

 

[barnsley]

550w would be 'enough' yes. What happens later when you want to add another GPU or something like that?
.

The average user doesn't suddenly wack in another GPU .

 

[JR23]

There are slightly more considerations to buying a quality power supply than simply 'is it enough', beyond the obvious efficiency and modularity, ripple suppression, pinout, connectors and acoustics are all factors. Most PSU's are semi-passive and hence running them much lower than their rated output keeps them totally silent, I can see why someone may justify over-speccing their PSU just to keep it quiet. That really depends on the rest of your setup.

Then there are pinouts and connectors to consider. If you ever intend to make custom sleeved cables you will be thankful of a simple pinout, Silverstones Strider series is pretty much unrivaled with no wires that split into two at all. 100% the one to go for if you intend to learn to sleeve for the first time. Even if you don't want to do it yourself consider what is available from the manufacturer or companies like cablemod. I mentioned connectors too as some smaller PSU's for example an RM550 only have one single PCIe connector on the PSU itself and then use a pigtail cable where as RM650's have two. I really dislike pigtails and would justify the added cost of a 650 for that alone. It's worth checking what the PSU itself outputs not just the cables.

I'm not trying to say that you do need more than a 550W although there are plenty of reasons beyond shear power output why you might justify something bigger.

JR

 

[Arne Saknussemm]

Jeepers...I don't get it sometimes.:-(

We all know 550W is "enough". The recommended minimum. That does not mean that the average system with that card draws 550W. The 550W is recommended because it has some overhead compared to what the system will actually draw. This is based on stock! If you are overclocking you don't want to eat that basic over-provisioning away...you want to keep it! so OCing you want a 650 for example.

Actually, not only do you want to keep that basic over-provisioning...you want to amplify it when OCing in the interests of stability and longevity. Do you know what percentage a PSU loses per year in delivery?

Also the rated W of a PSU is not as important as the build quality and rail system and the current rating of the rail (rails) in amperes. I kind of assumed that goes without saying but I'm not so sure now...

The only reason to buy a small PSU when building your own system is because you can't afford it...but is that really a good reason? I see people speccing out rigs with all the latest and greatest and then skimping on the PSU...the heart of the system...save up some more!

For the average single card build with overclocking in mind I would say 750W too and from a decent brand!

I would actually recommend any PC enthusiast buy an 850W Seasonic PSU.....to way cover stability, longevity, and the possibility to run a second card...the single easiest way of extending the gaming life of your rig...

What is the minimum Donkey I need to haul my hay?

Great resource for checking PSU provenance:
http://www.realhardtechx.com/index_archivos/PSUReviewDatabase.html

Great website for reviews
http://www.jonnyguru.com/

OP...good luck with the build and enjoy...whatever you choose

 

[faizp]

Although it is slightly opinionated, I find this guide useful when choosing between PSU Brands: http://i.imgur.com/tgrbCnr.jpg

 

[NeverBackDown]

Jeepers...I don't get it sometimes.:-(

I noticed

550watt is enough if he can find a quality unit and a unit that has all the connectors he plans on using. We never recommend anything here that's not a quality unit when it comes to PSUs. It goes without saying tbh... if you ever look around any recent PSU threads people really only recommend brands like Seasonic or Superflower or OEM brands that use either of the mentioned companies.

Now if OP ever decides to upgrade to a higher end GPU then like we said, get a bigger PSU. But as his current build is, 550watt is ample. My 760watt psu with a fury X OC'd and a 3570k at 1.21 volts running benchmarks barely gets the fan spinning. Under gaming load it doesn't even spin. So again 550watt is fine.

 

[AlienALX]

I noticed

550watt is enough if he can find a quality unit and a unit that has all the connectors he plans on using. We never recommend anything here that's not a quality unit when it comes to PSUs. It goes without saying tbh... if you ever look around any recent PSU threads people really only recommend brands like Seasonic or Superflower or OEM brands that use either of the mentioned companies.

Now if OP ever decides to upgrade to a higher end GPU then like we said, get a bigger PSU. But as his current build is, 550watt is ample. My 760watt psu with a fury X OC'd and a 3570k at 1.21 volts running benchmarks barely gets the fan spinning. Under gaming load it doesn't even spin. So again 550watt is fine.

You do realise you are talking to a professional overclocker with more experience than most?

Seriously I wouldn't even go there.

 

[barnsley]

The only reason to buy a small PSU when building your own system is because you can't afford it...but is that really a good reason? I see people speccing out rigs with all the latest and greatest and then skimping on the PSU...the heart of the system...save up some more!

Or maybe you're running a low powered/very quiet build? Seasonic do a great fanless Platinum rated 500w PSU for example. Not to mention that if you're going to run a PC which isn't going to be overclocked (be it due to thermal limitations of your case or otherwise) there is no point in spending £40 more on a power supply that will never even get close to being stressed.


Personally I'd go with 600w because thats often bang for buck when It comes to getting a solid PSU. It'll also give you enough legroom to run a future flagship card. Unless you're going for mad overclocks (which the vast majority of us don't..) you do not need a massive power supply for a single card.

 

[The_Mard]

Heyyo,

Hello,

I'm building a new computer from scratch. Here is almost a final version:

Intel I5 6600K (water cooling NZXT Kraken X41);
Asus Z170 Maximus VIII Ranger;
MSI R9 380 Gaming 4G;
Kingston HyperX Fury 2x 4GB 2666MHz DDR4;
1x SSD;
2x HDD;
Fractal Design Define S Window (1x front/1x rear 140mm fans).

Any other suggestions regarding this setup also welcome

Thanks

Well bud, tbh I'd recommend going another way with your build if you plan on using it for PC Gaming as a primary.

What I'm saying is... that R9 380 is quite limiting. Looking at your CPU, motherboard, GPU and RAM I'd definitely plop more money on your GPU tbh if you want the best graphics quality with performance.

Here's what I recommend changing your PC guts to:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($227.99 @ B&H)
CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken X41 106.1 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($99.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Motherboard: ASRock Fatal1ty Z97 Killer ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($71.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-2133 Memory ($47.89 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: MSI Radeon R9 390X 8GB Video Card ($409.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Total: $857.83
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-10-20 12:51 EDT-0400

Here's why:

In PC Gaming? GPU is more important than the CPU in many games and with DirectX 12 and Vulkan 3D API's that will slowly but eventually take over in 2016? GPUs will become even MORE important as the draw calls will get moved from the CPU to the GPU... so I'd recommend spending half your budget on the GPU. I went with the MSI R9 390X Gaming Edition because it's fantastic for the price to performance and it will spank the R9 380. Here's a perfect comparision where Toms Hardware did some MSI Gaming Edition GPUs: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-radeon-r9-390x-r9-380-r7-370,4178-6.html

Even if you don't want to get a 390x? The R9 390 is very close in performance with a slightly lower price. http://www.techspot.com/review/1019-radeon-r9-390x-390-380/page4.html

CPU? Intel i5-4690K. Why? It's barely slower when overclocked when you compare it to the i5-6600k but it does save you $30 and helps make up for the price difference between the R9 390X and the R9 390.

Motherboard? ASRock Z97 FATAL1TY. ASRock is a seriously underappreciated company. Their warranty is as good as the big names and they make very solid motherboards. Ther OC Formula boards have been used in the past to break CPU overclocking records too.

RAM? Gskil. They're another underrated manufacturer. Their RAM is good and carries lifetime warranty just like the rest... plus, red heatspreaders to match your build color on the motherboard and GPU. Win-win.

If you really want to keep the i5-6600k though? I'd still recommend stepping down the motherboard since you don't plan to CrossFire and step up your GPU. That Asus fancy board does help you get the best overclock you can yes... but for nearly double the price of a board that will give you comparable results? you're better off with a beefier GPU for performance. Here's what I'd recommend for your Sky Lake build:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($259.99 @ B&H)
CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken X41 106.1 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($99.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Motherboard: MSI Z170A PC MATE ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($109.98 @ OutletPC)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR4-2400 Memory ($47.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: MSI Radeon R9 390 8GB Video Card ($313.98 @ Newegg)
Total: $831.93
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-10-20 12:45 EDT-0400

To put things into price differences, here's your current build:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant


CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($259.99 @ B&H)
CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken X41 106.1 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($99.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Motherboard: Asus MAXIMUS VIII RANGER ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($202.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: Kingston FURY 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR4-2400 Memory ($56.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: MSI Radeon R9 380 4GB Video Card ($209.99 @ Newegg)
Total: $829.94
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-10-20 12:54 EDT-0400

So my recommended build with the R9 390X?
$857.83 - $829.94 = $27.89... and your games will run a LOT better.

My Sky Lake recommended build with the R9 390?
$831.93 - $829.94 = 1.99... and your games will run a LOT better.


Of course, just my opinion tbh... but your motherboard won't generate framerate, your GPU does though. You don't really need an enthusiast motherboard unless you're trying to set records on 3DMark or going for looks over performance since their heatsinks look fantastic.

Linus Tech Tips: Premium "Gaming" Motherboards - Are They Worth it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeuJAOVRoA0

Also, LOL at 3:40 in his video where Nyan Cat dies and falls off his monitor.



Ok... next thing... PSU's. You don't plan on CrossFire? That's fine, you can stick with a smaller PSU. I've always done a rule of thumb of 10% lower than the max Wattage rating of the PSU as a bare minimum. PSU's run hotter and less efficient drawing more power when they reach maximum load.

Let's use that first PcPartPicker list I made... estimated wattage of those parts? 457 Watts.

457 W * 110% = 502.7 Watts should be the bare minimum size... so the next size up is 550 Watts...

so that means... 457 estimate / 550 Watt PSU = estimated load of 83% on the PSU. She's well within safety rating and has room to overclock.

As for the whole 80 Plus Bronze Vs Gold? Meh, the efficiency power savings only really add up around the ten year mark... if your PSU even lives that long lol. The current standard warranty is five years... which is why I can't recommend Corsair tbh with only three year warranty on theirs.

With that in mind as well though? It's always good to look at sales... and right now EVGA are offering a $30 mail in rebate on certain PSU's bought from NCIX... so you can buy a 750W 80+ Bronze PSU that is semi-modular for the same price as regular priced 500 W PSUs which is badass.

http://pcpartpicker.com/part/evga-power-supply-110b20750vr

 

[DeGrab]

Hey guys,

thanks for your thoughts.

I do realize that PSU is probably the most important component, with continuous clean power, plenty of amps on the 12V rail etc. I was curious about the wattage as it seemed to me that generally people get way too much.

@ThE_MarD
good point, as it turns out I was thinking about MSI R9 390 8G, which would definitely be more suitable for this rig. I live in Europe so prices are a bit higher than what's on your list but still comparable I think.

MSI recommends 750W for this card, so EVGA G2 750W is on the shortlist, and this will be a one GPU system.

As for other components some are chosen just as a personal preference eg. I use ASUS MB right now so next one will be ASUS as well. But I will definitely check out some suggestions.

 

[The_Mard]

Hey guys,

thanks for your thoughts.

I do realize that PSU is probably the most important component, with continuous clean power, plenty of amps on the 12V rail etc. I was curious about the wattage as it seemed to me that generally people get way too much.

That's true. The main goal is to essentially keep your load from max. That 10% buffer is always a good rule of thumb... the whole 80 plus rating is for certain goals at 20%, 50% and 100% load. It's kind of silly though since it should have been around 80% to 90% load where most people could and should be using instead of just buying something overkill because of what the side of a box says... running a PSU at full load is just asking for trouble though so yeah that 100% load rating... yeah.

I still remember back in the day when FutureShop (RIP) used to stock a Rocketfish 700 Watt PSU which was a rebrand... after more digging around? I found out that the rebrand was an 800 Watt PSU... but when it hit 95% load? There was a high risk it the coils would fail and the PSU would potentially melt or catch on fire lol... so yeah, Rocketfish just de-rated it when they sold it.

@ThE_MarD
good point, as it turns out I was thinking about MSI R9 390 8G, which would definitely be more suitable for this rig. I live in Europe so prices are a bit higher than what's on your list but still comparable I think.

Ah I see. Fair enough amigo lol. I didn't know so I just went with the most common currency people use. I myself am Canadian.

Are you buying from a local store or online? I could help you search around for stuff. Asus also has some great Z97 boards for a cheaper price too tbh.

MSI recommends 750W for this card, so EVGA G2 750W is on the shortlist, and this will be a one GPU system.

As for other components some are chosen just as a personal preference eg. I use ASUS MB right now so next one will be ASUS as well. But I will definitely check out some suggestions.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

I dunno if you have a preferred merchant or if you plan on buying online and aren't picky so I'll just use the merchants that PcParPicker UK lists. So here's your current build:

CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor (£199.99 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken X41 106.1 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (£79.14 @ Aria PC)
Motherboard: Asus MAXIMUS VIII RANGER ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (£129.99 @ Amazon UK)
Memory: Kingston FURY 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR4-2400 Memory (£42.66 @ Ebuyer)
Video Card: MSI Radeon R9 380 4GB Video Card (£178.96 @ More Computers)
Total: £630.74
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-10-21 01:25 BST+0100

Btw, estimated wattage on this is 371 Watts * 110% = 408 Watts. Technically even a 550 Watt PSU is huge for this, but like I said look out for sales, sometimes the 750 and 850 Watt PSU's drop significantly. I bought my Thermaltake 850W Semi Modular 80+ Gold PSU for the same price 500 W 80+ bronze usually go for lol. She was dirt cheap and five year warranty so that was a big win.

WTH!? Either Amazon UK fuged up or something... but Intel CPU's are cheaper in the UK! That's awesome. Since usually VAT bones you guys so this is good to see.. or maybe VAT isn't calculated into PcPart Picker's price?

Anywho, now with my recommended build tweaked for the UK and an ASUS motherboard:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor (£169.99 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken X41 106.1 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (£79.14 @ Aria PC)
Motherboard: Asus Z97-P ATX LGA1150 Motherboard (£65.22 @ Dabs)
Memory: Kingston HyperX Fury Red 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1866 Memory (£33.58 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: MSI Radeon R9 390X 8GB Video Card (£339.55 @ More Computers)
Total: £687.48
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-10-21 01:55 BST+0100

You could save £10 if you went with the Asus Strix which will perform about the same tbh and it's also got some red. The MSI Gaming edition is the best one though for sheer performance.

Motherboard? Asus Z97-P. It's still a solid board and you said no plans to CrossFire so lack of it isn't bad. The only thing that kind of sucks i the choice of colors on the heat sink... it's not black or anything like that, it's some tint of gold or silver or something lol. It does have an M.2 port if you want to splurge on one of those SSD's. I dunno if you wanna do that or get a Samsung 850 Evo SATA 6Gb one. Up to you. I have a harder time recommending other SSD brands tbh since Kingstron double-dip on controllers and a few others have had stability issues. Besides, for the prices? the 850 Evo is a darn good deal.

I also stepped the RAM down to 1866 MHz due to saving a few bucks there too. Tbh RAM doesn't matter that much as long as you got 8GB and are above 1600 MHz. The benefits of fast RAM in gaming REALLY start to decline above that... probably why fast consumer RAM is so cheap because the manufacturers noticed that trend too.

So £687.48 - £630.74 = £56.74 difference.

Now, for Sky Lake option:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor (£199.99 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken X41 106.1 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (£79.14 @ Aria PC)
Motherboard: Asus Z170-P ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (£86.36 @ Amazon UK)
Memory: Kingston FURY 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR4-2666 Memory (£43.40 @ Ebuyer)
Video Card: MSI Radeon R9 390 8GB Video Card (£264.97 @ Amazon UK)
Total: £673.86
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-10-21 02:10 BST+0100

£673.86 - £630.74 = £43.12.

If you wanted a smaller gap though? You could drop the motherboard down to a ASUS Z170-P-D3 which is the same motherboard as above but with DDR3 slots. Like I said, the goal for RAM is 8GB 1866 MHz. Most games won't even notice the difference going to 8GB 2400 MHz DDR4.

Here's the DDR3 sky lake build:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor (£199.99 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken X41 106.1 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (£79.14 @ Aria PC)
Motherboard: Asus Z170-P D3 ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (£81.91 @ More Computers)
Memory: Kingston HyperX Fury Red 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1866 Memory (£33.58 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: MSI Radeon R9 390 8GB Video Card (£264.97 @ Amazon UK)
Total: £659.59
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-10-21 02:30 BST+0100

£659.59 - £630.74 = £28.85.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utWnjA4NzSA

DDR4! because it's a number higher than DDR3! lol. Thanks Linus.

But yeah, since that LTT video came out? Asus put out the Z170-P-D3. But yeah, look at Bioshock Infinite as a prime example... DDR3 1866 MHz with a latency of 10 actually scored HIGHER than DDR4 2666 MHz with a latency of 15... so for gaming, lower latency ram seems to be more important than clock speeds. Interesting stuff eh?

 

[NeverBackDown]

But yeah, since that LTT video came out? Asus put out the Z170-P-D3. But yeah, look at Bioshock Infinite as a prime example... DDR3 1866 MHz with a latency of 10 actually scored HIGHER than DDR4 2666 MHz with a latency of 15... so for gaming, lower latency ram seems to be more important than clock speeds. Interesting stuff eh?

Speed is generally > than latency. However it's also game dependent any really doesn't make a difference anyway. RAM is so much faster than anything else in the system that really even the lowest speeds will change performance less than changing a setting in the game.