Leaky Rad *sigh*

[Scoob]

Hi all,

Just been building my WC loop - build log of sorts up soon - and I've run into a little problem.

My rad is a Phobya 1080 (9x120 in effect) and it's mounted in an external chassis - all very neat and tidy. During leak testing I had the odd drip around some of the fittings - namely the Koolance QDC to Phobya compression fitting, those two aren't very compatible. A small Phobya extension placed in between gave me a good seal though.

As leak testing was done and the thing passed after sorting the above, I popped the proper coolant in, tested again for ages, before finally using the PC. Have been using it for a couple of days without issues.

Last night I'd just finished on the PC for the evening having been gaming and I noticed a small puddle of coolant under one of the compression fittings connected to the rad. It's the "IN" fitting so is directly after the pump (a variable speed D5, set on 5) I thought at first that the compression had come a little loose - I've noticed that this isn't uncommon, i.e. you get the compression TIGHT then the low temperature of the coolant once you start running it make it feel slightly loose. Anyway, I checked the hose-side of the compression and managed to get another 8th turn (by hand) on it, the rad-side of the compression was good.

I cleaned everything up so it was dry, and left the loop running (PC off) for around 15 minutes with a bit of loo roll under the compression in questions. After this time I could see that I had about one or two drops on the loo roll, so I'd not fixed the issue.

I QDC'd the res assembly and popped it on my desk, it was then I noticed the beading of water NOT around the compression (but running down it) rather it started from the RADIATOR. Balls.

Basically my rad is mounted vertically with the fittings at the bottom. The bits where you screw in your fittings are, I assume, welded in during production. It seems that there's a micro-fracture around this fitting causing it to seep slightly - more when under pressure from the pump of course.

Not sure if this is something, if not common, at least know to happen. I.e. a small manufacturing defect only showing up after a couple of days of running.

I know I've not done any damage as I've done everything finger-tight throughout - in fact that's the reason I thought it was likely just a slightly loose compression at first. Also, as anyone who's done it will know, it's quite tricky to tighten the block end of a 90 degree rotary as you've not got much area to grip - certainly not on the Phobya fittings I use. This added to my thought that it likely wasn't quite tight enough.

I suppose it's possible that the rad took a knock at some point, though the packaging seemed fine with no evidence of it being bounced. It's certainly not been dropped by me as it was placed in the rad chassis soon after I took it out of its box, so it's been safely in that since - it was the first item I added of course as the shrouds, fans, fittings, res pump all mount on the chassis too.

So, I have a leaky rad...I'll have to see what the shop I bought all my bits from say on Monday. I guess it'll have to be replaced as it's not even a week old yet - got it all Tuesday last week. If I'd been running it for months I'd likely just try to patch it with something...but as it's brand new it really should be replaced...what a pain!

I'd been really quite cheerful until this - a job well done you know? Just started enjoying the SILENCE during gaming, plus I thought it all looked quite smart - if not LED bling just yet lol.

Thoughts?

Scoob.

 

[Vicey]

I have this same radiator in my setup. It's a great radiator but I would say the welding does look a little hap-dash in parts. It's definitely not built to the same quality as say a Black Ice SR-1 but it's very affordable, heck my SR-1 240mm cost as much as the 1080 Phobya.

I'm sure you'll get a good one if you RMA it, these things happen unfortunately. I've been running mine about 8 months and it hasn't leaked yet so good ones do exist

 

[Scoob]

Hi Vicey,

I'd certainly agree this is a "cheap" radiator from a build quality stand-point, well, not "cheap" as such, but budget aware shall we say. The paint is very thin giving everything that "rusty" look of the copper showing through. Still, I didn't buy it for its looks but rather the performance it offered for the price. I was looking at getting a pair of the Alphacool NeXXXos Monsta 80mm thick 360's but that was more than double the price for slightly less overall rad area.

So a good rad, but built to a budget for sure...guess I just got a little unlucky with mine having a slight defect.

Have you noticed that the bit that fails is usually the bit you have 101 other things attached to, so you have to disassemble EVERYTHING (it feels) to replace it? Lol.

Scoob.

 

[Vicey]

I've been quite lucky with water cooling. I've only ever had one leak which was from a Koolance SLI fitting. I tightened it with some pliers because using thumb and finger did not compress its o-ring enough due to the thumb-friendly nut on the fitting being about 1mm in thickness and impossible to grip with human fingers while exerting enough force to tighten it.

Apart from that tiny leak I've been good with everything else and never needed to disassemble the whole loop.

When I added my Phobya radiator to my loop (I originally used 140mm and 280mm SR-1's inside the case) I had to disassemble everything to get those large radiators outside of the case but that was more of an upgrade to me than anything else And I have to say the Phobya 1080 far surpasses those radiators I had before. It's sheer size and being outside of the case with cooler air brought my temps down dramatically.

Similar to you I'm using Koolance Quick Disconnects on my Phobya rad so I can easily disconnect it from the case. I've not had any issues with those. Bloody expensive fittings but worth it as they work great.

 

[Scoob]

Hi mate,

Yeah, things were going smoothly for me too - only those QDC's giving me hassle until I used an extension between them. I got the parts Tuesday last week - found that I couldn't use my SLI connectors as my two EK blocks did NOT line up (different revision of 570's, though GPU core and RAM are in the same place - go figure) so I had to order some extra bits. So, in effect, I only started on the build proper on Thursday evening, did some more Friday and basically finished it in the evening. It all went rather well and was easier than I expected. So, it's even more of a shame in a way that the issue I do get is a pull it all apart one.

Regarding tightening things by hand... I've been using those disposable rubber surgical gloves. They're tight and give you really good grip on the compression fittings - far better than without.

The performance of the Phobya has been quite good, my 570's (@ 850mhz) just get into the 40's during Heaven 3.0 runs, the CPU (2500k @ 4.5ghz) isn't quite so cool tho as it can still get into the 70's during IBT - low 50's in normal gaming though. Not much better than my Antec Kuhler 620. The CPU block is the EK Supreme HF "EN" so it is a good one...possibly a slight air lock there or my TIM work wasn't so good. Will need to revisit that I think.

Still, replacement rad = re-bleeding stuff. While my PC is separate thanks to the QDC's the air in the new rad will of course go through the entire system...

Scoob.

 

[Vicey]

I have a similar CPU block I'm using the EK Supreme LTX Waterblock. I have the pump going straight in to the CPU block though as I believe having the maximum pressure at the block gives the best results. Not that I have any data to correlate that.

My temps are 30c idle on the CPU and 50-55c load at 4.35GHz @ 1.30v (3930K)

 

[Scoob]

After the reading I'd done I chose to have the GPU's (parallel flow) first in the loop as they put less heat into the loop than the CPU.

I will say though that I have a "bad" 2500k - it needs a fairly high vCore to sit at 4.5, though naturally (on auto) my CPU seems to need a lot too. I'm at a vCore of 1.366 under load at 4.5ghz - IBT load can see it nearer 1.38v. Additionally my Core #3 is the weakest and in any isolation tests #0,1 & 2 work flawlessly, where #3 will fall over (or even cause a BSOD) at the same level. Interestingly #3 is not the hottest core at all.

So, 70c in IBT (which IS a harsh test) at 1.38 vCore isn't so bad, but not great. A better CPU would see much improved results I've no doubt. I see low-to-mid 60's in Prime95 blend test and typically no more than mid-50's even in CPU demanding games.

I still plan to check the TIM under the CPU block though, in case I screwed up.

Scoob.

 

[NRG!]

I have a 1260 from the same range. When it arrived there were small chips on the paint on the tank end and it generally looked cheap.

Doesn't leak though so I don't care, it's on the matching stand underneath the desk and I can't see it.

 

[airdeano]

welcome to the leaky club. i haven't had the chance on a leaky bung, but the tubes have
had micro holes (followed the green growth) with no real puddles or equipment damages
just inconvience. though some are checked to 5-bar (72.5psi) some are so thin they bloat
like a shaken soda can.

airdeano

 

[Scoob]

Hi NRG!,

Glad yours is good. I looked at the 1260 myself, but the 1080 along with the 180mm fans seemed a nice balance. My 1080 does have thinning paint here and there - more so where I have been fitting and re-fitting things in an attempt to indentify the problem. Also I suspect the coolant (EK pre-mix) isn't particularly paint-friendly either. There was also the odd nick (tiny) on some of the fins...only two or three though. Doesn't suggest it was handled with care prior to boxing to me...

I suspect if I'd not had the QDC problem - forcing me to stop my leak test after 5 minutes each time - that I'd have spotted the rad issue sooner as it does take about 15 minutes running (D5 @ 5) before it actually builds up enough to drip.

airdeano: I thought the Phobya's were 2 bar tested, so still quite high but not crazy high like 5 bar...I'd be surprised if it didn't go pop at that pressure. On a related note, I don't know how much pressure the D5 can produce - obviously that first port on the rad is before the first big restriction so would, I expect, be a high-pressure area.

I'm currently waiting for some more stock to come in, then hopefully I can start arranging a replacement. There's likely going to be more discussions with Phobya (the boss of the place I bought the rad from has been speaking to them) as they're currently unconvinced of the issue. Still, I'm confident that once they test it they will see the same thing I do.

Cheers,

Scoob.

 

[airdeano]

airdeano: I thought the Phobya's were 2 bar tested, so still quite high but not crazy high like 5 bar...I'd be surprised if it didn't go pop at that pressure.

you are correct not 5-bar (CPU/GPU pressure checks), but even at 2-bar (29.5psi)
is a pressure keg.

i'll post correction..

airdeano

 

[NRG!]

Hi NRG!,

Glad yours is good. I looked at the 1260 myself, but the 1080 along with the 180mm fans seemed a nice balance. My 1080 does have thinning paint here and there - more so where I have been fitting and re-fitting things in an attempt to indentify the problem. Also I suspect the coolant (EK pre-mix) isn't particularly paint-friendly either. There was also the odd nick (tiny) on some of the fins...only two or three though. Doesn't suggest it was handled with care prior to boxing to me...

I suspect if I'd not had the QDC problem - forcing me to stop my leak test after 5 minutes each time - that I'd have spotted the rad issue sooner as it does take about 15 minutes running (D5 @ 5) before it actually builds up enough to drip..

I went for the 1260 with 4x200mm fans in the end because It gives me that bit extra raddage to allow me to cool more than one system. ATM I have tentative plans for an ITX folding rig in the prodigy, which I'd simply add to my existing loop. (not sure how to route the tubing out yet though :/.

The way I've rigged it up is with my res pump and rad on the stand under the desk. The flow goes from the pump into the rad, then through a koolance QDC and into the case, out through a QDC and into the res. This means that once the rad is bled (easier than it sounds - I fill it up separate from the loop in the bath ) Anything I add to the loop will send the air straight to the res and there's no bleeding to be done.

Look into mayhems coolant, it's nicer. But be aware that the 'aurora' range is not suitable for this.

Mine had a couple of bent fins which i bent back into shape roughly using a small screwdriver lol, I've also bent a few myself while flush >.<.

Phobya products do have an air of cheapness about them though in my experience. Originally I was using phobya QDCs and they leaked everywhere. My phobya res also arrived with a damaged acrylic tube.

 

[Scoob]

airdeano: Yeah, even 2.0 bar is quite a lot of pressure, especially with water as it's far less easily compressed than air. Turbo on both my cars only runs to 1.5 bar - which is enough to blow of hoses and pop weaker intercoolers and that's with nice, squishy air lol.

NRG!: Nice. Sorta wish I'd gone for the larger rad in some ways...cos it's larger and all lol.

I've designed mine as a "water box" with the QDC's so I can, in theory, easily transfer it to cool another loop - say in my next system for example. In all likelyhood though I'll just buy new bits cos it's fun building this stuff

It largely depends on how much of the current system is salvaged. I always envisaged that my current system would become my next media box - using my 2500k's built-in GPU, so my new loop would only have to cool the CPU meaning an in-case 240 rad (or two) would be more than enough - or just simply pop my Antec Kuhler 620 back on. Might then sell the blocked up 570's if there's a call for them. That means water box would go directly to the new build. However, there is a good chance that I'll just downgrade the entire build, water box and all, to other duties & get new rad, pump, res etc. for my next build.

So, the above condensed is I have options...cash permitting lol

Scoob.