£450 is a really good price for these.
I'm getting to like the HP laptops. For the prices mentioned, AMD mobility Turon/Athlon/Sempron cpu options and ATI 4200M, memory up to 8g ddr2 (800mhz).
Bluray drives, nice solid builds. They do a good line in docking stations too.
U can imagine £450 being the lower options, but even so, the better cpus aren't going to bump the price that much.
Gutter ? Meh, I know a bunch of people who need that.