AMD Freesync Review

[Kushiro]

Nvidia have done a lot to lock people into their ecosystem lately, from Shield In-Home streaming, G-Sync, 3DVision, Physx, CUDA, the Geforce Experience and even through GameWorks.

TBH right now I don't trust Nvidia's business decisions as they are very anti-competitive. AMD by contrast are very open standards heavy, but a lot of this is due to them being the underdog with less money to pump into R&D.

Nvidia are a company that make fantastic hardware, but I do think they do too much to lock people into their ecosystem. It is both a good thing and a bad thing IMHO, Nvidia offers these things, but they also limit your options to look elsewhere.

Completely agree with the above and an investigation is by no means warranted. Besides thanks to all the moronic decisions Nvidia has been making, AMD has been given many opportunities to exploit. Therefor their actions are indeed benefiting the consumers. I am not at all a fan of companies finding ways to lock people into their ecosystem, however look at all the new technology we have gotten thanks to AMD wanting to make their products competitive and Nvidia doing what they love to do.

 

[NeverBackDown]

I am dead against any closed standards and systems as ultimately they rip off the customer and are bad for the industry.

The EU have been tough on Microsoft in the past and I think they should also take this approach with Apple NVidia AMD or anyone else who try and lock people in.

Lets face it before Microsoft got clobbered it was still easier to change your browser than it is to change your monitor now.

AMD are not locking people in. It is an Open Standard set by VESA. Only reason why it currently only works with AMD is because Nvidia refuses to support it. The only person forcing people to stay locked in is Nvidia. Nvidia cards can support it.. they choose not to. Your opinion on the matter should not be aimed towards AMD and instead to Nvidia.

Nvidia have done a lot to lock people into their ecosystem lately, from Shield In-Home streaming, G-Sync, 3DVision, Physx, CUDA, the Geforce Experience and even through GameWorks.

TBH right now I don't trust Nvidia's business decisions as they are very anti-competitive. AMD by contrast are very open standards heavy, but a lot of this is due to them being the underdog with less money to pump into R&D.

Nvidia are a company that make fantastic hardware, but I do think they do too much to lock people into their ecosystem. It is both a good thing and a bad thing IMHO,
Nvidia offers these things, but they also limit your options to look elsewhere.

Nvidia is pretty much an Apple company but in a different market. With all the things they lock you down with and nothing being compatible to outside standards(itunes, thunderbolt(to an extent), lightning dock(not usb), ecosystem). I never had anything against Nvidia on the GPU side, but lately i'm doubting them.

 

[Kaapstad]

If only the monitor manufacturers agreed a standard amongst themselves and incorporated it into all monitors and then left it up to NVidia and AMD to as to whether they wanted to use it. At the moment everything is being done backwards at the expense of the user.

 

[NeverBackDown]

If only the monitor manufacturers agreed a standard amongst themselves and incorporated it into all monitors and then left it up to NVidia and AMD to as to whether they wanted to use it. At the moment everything is being done backwards at the expense of the user.

Vesa sets the standards.. AMD encouraged and helped the tech to be incorporated into the newest DP standard, which they call FreeSync when really its called Adaptive Sync. Again its only being done the current way it is because Nvidia aren't allowing their cards to work for Freesync. Nvidia cards can use.. they just won't. Do agree it sucks for us though because one company is screwing everything up.

 

[Kaapstad]

Vesa sets the standards.. AMD encouraged and helped the tech to be incorporated into the newest DP standard, which they call FreeSync when really its called Adaptive Sync. Again its only being done the current way it is because Nvidia aren't allowing their cards to work for Freesync. Nvidia cards can use.. they just won't. Do agree it sucks for us though because one company is screwing everything up.

Sounds like the EU needs to start earning it's keep and investigating NVidia and Apple for that matter. The current situation is appalling and restrictive.

 

[Kushiro]

In the end, its their product, their rules. Dont like it, find a different one. The EU dont have the power to tell Nvidia what to do, nor apple for that matter.

 

[NeverBackDown]

Sounds like the EU needs to start earning it's keep and investigating NVidia and Apple for that matter. The current situation is appalling and restrictive.

Nothing they can do. Its just how business works. Now if Nvidia or AMD were paying people to only sell their products then thats a different story. But since people have options its not the companies fault.

 

[Kaapstad]

In the end, its their product, their rules. Dont like it, find a different one. The EU dont have the power to tell Nvidia what to do, nor apple for that matter.

Nothing they can do. Its just how business works. Now if Nvidia or AMD were paying people to only sell their products then thats a different story. But since people have options its not the companies fault.

Don't agree

If I go and buy a monitor I expect it to work equally well whether I am using an AMD, NVidia or any other card.

What would happen if intel got on the bandwagon with their own system for integrated graphics what a mess that would be with 3 different systems.

 

[Kushiro]

If that were to happen, then so be it. There is nothing a consumer can do. What is it you expect the EU to do exactly? Investigate? Fine? Fine what? They have done nothing wrong... It is up to the individual company what it is they design and sell.

In an ideal world I would agree with you, however Im pretty sure we all know how far from ideal reality is.

 

[Kaapstad]

If that were to happen, then so be it. There is nothing a consumer can do. What is it you expect the EU to do exactly? Investigate? Fine? Fine what? They have done nothing wrong... It is up to the individual company what it is they design and sell.

You could make the same argument about Microsoft and their web browser and look what happened there.

 

[Kushiro]

That must be before my time, what happened exactly?

 

[Zoot]

FreeSync is Adaptive-Sync. It is not limited to AMD GPUs.

FreeSync is just an additional certification/branding process that AMD are doing on top of Adaptive-Sync - similar to the way that NVIDIA test & certify each G-Sync display.

Adaptive-Sync (FreeSync) should work with any GPU via a driver update. We just don't know when the drivers from Intel/NVIDIA are coming.

That's what I thought, although Tom did mention the 3 as if they were all seperate in the video, but I haven't been following things as much for the last few months.

I also think that the EU should investigate and if needed fine both NVidia and AMD for restrictive practices locking people into their systems.

Why does everyone always want the government to do something?

If you don't like either Freesync or G-Sync, vote with your wallet and don't buy monitors that support either. If enough people do it, both companies won't be long getting the message. It's not as if monitors without G-Sync or Freesync are going to disappear any time soon.

 

[Kaapstad]

If you don't like either Freesync or G-Sync, vote with your wallet and don't buy monitors that support either. If enough people do it, both companies won't be long getting the message. It's not as if monitors without G-Sync or Freesync are going to disappear any time soon.

I do use a monitor without G-Sync or Freesync and it is also of far higher quality than anything available for the two systems mentioned.

I also use both NVidia and AMD cards so I also find it laughable that some time in the future I would need separate monitors for each. A single monitor with multiple inputs is far cheaper and space saving.

 

[barnsley]

That must be before my time, what happened exactly?

Unless you were born in 2010 it wasn't before your time
EU browser ruling for windows. It is an EU only ruling though.


I say that EU needs to get involved because Apple/Nvidia are both the much more powerful company (compared to android et al and AMD) and saying 'vote with your wallet' won't fix a thing. Voting with your wallet hasn't worked in the past, so why should it work now?

 

[steverebo]

Unless you were born in 2010 it wasn't before your time
EU browser ruling for windows. It is an EU only ruling though.


I say that EU needs to get involved because Apple/Nvidia are both the much more powerful company (compared to android et al and AMD) and saying 'vote with your wallet' won't fix a thing. Voting with your wallet hasn't worked in the past, so why should it work now?

EU wont even look at this, its completely different to the browser ruling as Windows pretty much has the monopoly when it comes to operating systems on the PC which is why it was such a problem as people didnt have any other choice but to use windows and microsoft used this to their advantage forcing you to use internet explorer.

In this situation there is an alternative your not being forced to buy nvidia or gsync you could buy AMD and freesync or you could just buy nvidia/AMD and a standard monitor as its not a prerequisite to have a gsync or freesync monitor to own one of these GPU's . The EU would look at this from the outside and say "if you dont like it then dont buy it and buy AMD instead, simple as that".

Nvidia although the much bigger company do not in any way hold the monopoly on discreet graphics.

What Nvidia are doing is actually a good thing for existing customers because they are creating an ecosystem around their GPU's and saying "buy nvidia and get physx, god rays, SMAA, TXAA, SLi, Geforce experience and gsync".

AMD tried to do a similar thing with MANTEL but it didnt take off as well and as the under dog they have taken the open approach in order to attract customers that way but do not be misguided and think that if AMD were in Nvidia's shoes they would not be doing the same thing and they are already attempting to build an ecosystem around their own cards. I do think that if they are going to only support gsync then they should atleast bring the prices of their gsync monitors down to match the adapive sync/freesync alternative's as charging the premium now that alternatives are available is a bit naughty.


Nvidia should be fined for what they did with the GTX 970 and should not have gotten away with that as it was downright criminal but when it comes to the whole ecosystem they have created I quiet like it and its a great way to attract new customers and retain existing ones.

What it all boils down to is if you dont like it then don't bloody buy it!!

 

[Kaapstad]

EU wont

76% of the market is pretty close to a monopoly for NVidia.

If they are also charging extra for the same features on a G-Sync monitor as you get on a Freesync monitor that is worthy of investigation by the EU.

As for Microsoft and their browser all the user had to do was install a different one if they wanted to but the EU still got involved.

 

[steverebo]

76% of the market is pretty close to a monopoly for NVidia.

If they are also charging extra for the same features on a G-Sync monitor as you get on a Freesync monitor that is worthy of investigation by the EU.

As for Microsoft and their browser all the user had to do was install a different one if they wanted to but the EU still got involved.

EU were just waiting for an opportunity to hit Microsoft when all that happened it was part official investigation part whitch hunt as Microsoft had owned the market untouched for so long.

76% bloody hell didnt realise it was that high to be honest.

Nvidia can quiet easily argue that gsync does not do the exact same thing as adaptive sync even if the difference is small its still different otherwise vesa would have had them on copyright infringement. Also supporting the vesa standard is completely voluntary.

EU still wont touch this, they didnt touch the whole 970 issue and that was outright law breaking. You are not being forced to buy Nvidia and you are not being forced to buy gsync as all nvidia gpu's will work just fine without it.

Remember Adaptive sync/freesync/gsync are all OPTIONAL extras to your system build.

It still boils down to the same thing in the end, you are not being forced to buy nvidia, there is an alternative that works just as well so if you dont want to buy gsync then dont buy an nvidia gpu.

 

[Kaapstad]

EU were just waiting for an opportunity to hit Microsoft when all that happened it was part official investigation part whitch hunt as Microsoft had owned the market untouched for so long.

76% bloody hell didnt realise it was that high to be honest.

Nvidia can quiet easily argue that gsync does not do the exact same thing as adaptive sync even if the difference is small its still different otherwise vesa would have had them on copyright infringement. Also supporting the vesa standard is completely voluntary.

EU still wont touch this, they didnt touch the whole 970 issue and that was outright law breaking. You are not being forced to buy Nvidia and you are not being forced to buy gsync as all nvidia gpu's will work just fine without it.

Remember Adaptive sync/freesync/gsync are all OPTIONAL extras to your system build.

It still boils down to the same thing in the end, you are not being forced to buy nvidia, there is an alternative that works just as well so if you dont want to buy gsync then dont buy an nvidia gpu.

Unfortunately this all goes wrong if like me you already own an NVidia card. When it is monitor upgrade time I am then forced to buy a G-Sync one at a higher price than a Freesync one.

 

[steverebo]

Your not forced to do anything your forgetting g-sync/adaptive sync/freesync are not a requirement they are an optional technology at present. Your nvidia gpu would work perfectly with a non gsync monitor but if you decide you want to use the new technology you have the choice to buy a gsync one or swap gpu's and buy a freesync one.

That is the overriding thing people are overlooking and getting caught up in the nvidia should or shouldn't. It's not a prerequisite to owning an nvidia gpu it's an OPTIONAL extra.

 

[Oh Bother]

I do use a monitor without G-Sync or Freesync and it is also of far higher quality than anything available for the two systems mentioned.

I also use both NVidia and AMD cards so I also find it laughable that some time in the future I would need separate monitors for each. A single monitor with multiple inputs is far cheaper and space saving.

The good thing about Adaptive-Sync is that it operates as part of the standard driving electronics you typically see in displays.
It doesn't completely replace the innards of the monitor, so it will be possible for high-end monitors (e.g. Eizo) to support Adaptive-Sync.

What I'm really hoping for is that since general display manufacturers like LG are starting to have support for this, that we will start to see it appear in televisions as well. One of those OLEDs they make with Adaptive-Sync support would make an amazing screen for games.

AMD tried to do a similar thing with MANTEL but it didnt take off as well and as the under dog they have taken the open approach in order to attract customers that way

No, AMD have always said that Mantle was going to be opened up.
That plan changed somewhat when Mantle became the basis for Vulkan. (next-gen OpenGL)
The function calls in Vulkan are the same as Mantle, with the prefix changed to vk.

So the next-gen OpenGL that NVIDIA will be taking advantage of will largely be based on AMD's work.
Funny how you don't see NVIDIA going "oh well we'll just make our own API instead" when it's something like next-gen OpenGL support rather than peripheral support like Adaptive-Sync.