Why onboard sound so poor ?

[Rastalovich]

7.1 / 5.1 / 3d effects / "quality" / AC`97 / SoundMax / MCE

wtef!

Not experienced a good->v.good onboard sound myself, stero/3 speaker setups u can just about get away with, but anything that involves playing a 3d sound driven game just doesn`t cut it.

Why ?

 

[FarFarAway]

Well some of the high-def Realtech stuff is "ok" tho a little harsh by my ears.

The discrete boards have a dedicated audio processor, dedicated power, high quality caps transisters etc and use more expensive components

Not only all that but they're seperate from any overclocking thats going on so get no interference like the onboard does

 

[FleX.overclock3d]

My mobo has onboard Realtek HD Audio, it was only recently replaced with a X-Fi Gamercard due to wanting to use the Xram in bf2142

 

[FragTek]

Lucky for me I use the optical out port on my board and the quality is pretty damn good through the onboard audio processor and doesn't require the kind of horsepower that using the analog jacks do. So the long and short of my post is use the onboard optical if you have it, if you use analog then DEFFO get a sound card.

 

[PP Mguire]

I use onboard and its actualy not as bad as people say. I work with audio everyday and you can call me an audiophile but i use a 2.1 (or w/e you wanna call it) system so i dont need the audio power to produce sound for 5 or 7 speakers. If you have a good speaker setup you can pretty much make anything sound good whether its onboard or an X-FI. The funny thing is and its a perfect example of what i say. My friend has an Xtreme Music, and i use my onboard Karajan module. He has his cheap 2.1 from Dell and i have these JBLs. From listening to our sound you would think i had the X-FI instead. So really, its like my dad says. You may have the PA (In this case sound card) but if the sound guy out front dosent know how to use it, it still sounds like crap.

 

[chudley]

To coin an analogy that works for me, you wouldnt use onboard graphics to play quality games, so why use on board sound to listen to quality music.

 

[Rastalovich]

To coin an analogy that works for me, you wouldnt use onboard graphics to play quality games, so why use on board sound to listen to quality music.

lmao, that is so refreshingly true - it`s actually too easy to think of. -- but very very true.

Nice1.

It`s like I say, music aint a great problem, but u can notice the difference on something like an online mmo where they have 3d sounds from other players or mobs. U chuck in a card and the difference becomes all too aparent.

 

[chudley]

Cheers glad you like it- feel free to use at your own discretion as its still patent pending

 

[glocktodahead]

I don't have a sound card. I want to get one so I can hear the difference.

 

[PP Mguire]

To coin an analogy that works for me, you wouldnt use onboard graphics to play quality games, so why use on board sound to listen to quality music.

When you dont have the other equipment to back it up then it makes it pointless. Thats like getting an X-FI Elite PRO and a cheap pair of headphones from the Dollar Store. The analogy works, but only to an extent. Also, most people cant even tell the difference between 24 voices and 64 voices because of their cheap speakers or headphones or they just dont pay attention enough.

 

[ionicle]

i cant tell the difference between AC-97, and Audigy 2, or any of this THX stuff, through my speakers, it all sounds the same

 

[chudley]

Not too sure but judging by the first thread he cant get good sound, which means he knows what good sound is and can tell the difference between diff voices.

The fact is sometimes this has to be demonstrated to people so they know what to listen for. And so developes the ear, play a chord with 3 notes and a chord with 5 notes, ask the listener to state the chord and they may struggle. the trained ear wil be more confident in its assertions but not always correctif it is c and c minor

I for the record am tone deaf so please do not ask me to prove my comments.

Ask my dad (beethoven)

 

[Dav0s]

well the difference used to be partly because of the interference that onboard sound got from other components on the mobo, but since the dfi 939 kerijan (sp?) modules its just cos they cant be bothered, and most people dont mind

 

[PP Mguire]

TBH i believe my onboard is a whole lot better than my old 5.1 or even the 24-bit 7.1 (ive had both). I can run any games maxed sound cause i dont use EAX at all. So hardware sound high for me, cause i dont want to use Advanced HD or EAX2 or 3 or anything like that. I get good sound by the devices i plug into my soundcard.

 

[PV5150]

Nvidia Soundstorm on the nf2's was the best onboard period! The Realtek audio is absolute crap imho, especially AC1988. I much prefer a dedicated card for my PC's sound and gaming, as you get better fps, it doesn't go funky when you overclock and it sounds a hell of a lot bettter.

 

[FarFarAway]

TBH i believe my onboard is a whole lot better than my old 5.1 or even the 24-bit 7.1 (ive had both). I can run any games maxed sound cause i dont use EAX at all. So hardware sound high for me, cause i dont want to use Advanced HD or EAX2 or 3 or anything like that. I get good sound by the devices i plug into my soundcard.

OK, but there are others who do have decent stuff to plug into their sound cards and there is a helluva lot of difference between onboard and discrete sound

 

[Toxteth O'Grady]

I think we're seeing a gradual migration away from the pci bus to onboard as technology improves and mainboard chips get smaller/better. Remember the days of having to have pci cards for just about everything, USB ports, firewire ports, network adaptor. Most people quite happily use these onboard now. I think that's partly why companies like NVidia and ATI started getting into chipsets. I think onboard sound is getting closer and is probably good enough if you're using low-fi amplification and speakers. Decoding sound files is very easy/cheap circuitry these days. I have a £9.99 Superdrug DVD player with 5.1 optical out. I plug it into my £2000 Denon home theatre amp and it sounds just as awesome as my £400 Denon DVD player.

For graphics I don't think onboard will ever get there because there's no push for that business/technology model. Separate GPUs cards are developing into mini-computers in their own right.

Just my own thoughts, FWIW.



TOG

 

[mrapoc]

From my "HD Realtek onboard" to my "Creative X Fi Xtreme music" the difference was amazing...Whereas my friend just bought some logitech z5500 speakers (the top model one) and is using them on his onboard 7.1 and tbh the quality sucks.

 

[Rastalovich]

I think we can all agree that listening to a wasp/bee going around in circles demonstrating 3d audio is one thing. (one of the wizards for onboard)

Listening to music is another.

But the crux of it is the depth for the likes of 3d gaming and, for me, 3d movies. ApocalypseNow`s helicopters on the shore, or Heat`s shout-out scene, played through onboard and a simple creative 5.1 is just totally different.

Personally I don`t go for eax, that`s not important to me on a card, but that aside, it`s really a question (as usual) of what u`r gonna use the pc for.

I think this can change tho, and the market is open for gaming/htpc pc-motherboards, with excellent quality (well `great`) gfx and great sound, legacy free and made really small. To sum it up, I`m looking at AMD/ATI/Creative. Not the onboard stuff of today, but something they can pursue that would make a gaming/movie pc something the size of an XBox, and maintain a quality.

But I hear u say why not just buy an XBox... which is a fair comment, but although the XBox gen is a tremendous platform in it`s own right, a PC box, with all it`s advantages of not having to buy expensive unique hardware that only works for it (I`m thinking USB devices, drives etc) is a huge advantage. - and u don`t have to then have a pc and an xbox prehaps. meh.

hmm something for AMD to think about maybe.

 

[PP Mguire]

I much prefer a dedicated card for my PC's sound and gaming, as you get better fps, it doesn't go funky when you overclock and it sounds a hell of a lot bettter.

When i OCed that 3000+ my sound was still perfect. When i was OCing my X2 3800+ on my old nF3 board, my sound was funky. Thats the difference between better onboard and worse onboard. The problem here is, everybody has a "stereo-type" of onboard that all onboard is crap. Well thats not exactly true. Like i was saying, i get better sound outa my JBL 2.1 LAN speakers and onboard than my friend does with his Xtreme Music and Dell 2.1. But wait, yet you plug in my JBLs and it still sounds bad. Why? His EQ settings on WMP and his Creative mixer crap is WAYYY outa whack. Like i was saying before, just becasue you have the equipment dosent mean you can use it. MOst everybody nowadays wants everything to be plug and play and it sounds great. Im willing to use a cheaper onboard and take the time to make it sound good instead of spending money on something im not really gonna use. (If i would have seen that 75$ FAT X-FI at Frys i would have gotten it though). Sorta like people saying Bose is crap, no they arent. You gotta know how to set it up.

What gets me even more is people and their argument on 5.1 and movies. They like to hear that 3d sound helicopter. (Not saying its any of you, just mere experience from people here) The worst part is, most of them have their rear speakers in front of them on the desk cause they have no place to put them behind them. Im like dude, whats the difference? You spent all that money on those Z5500s and that X-FI Fat card yet your not even using it still? Hes like, yea i am sounds great! Im like your not even using the "3d audio effect" part of it cause your rear speakers are in front of you! Im like here, lemme proove it to you. *Puts his speakers on my onboard in other room, hook them up right, tweak audio and eq settings then plays game* Hmm, sounds better. Then i tell him, if your gonna spend the money, at least learn how to use it. All he wants to say is, well im not in a proffesional PA company, how can i? I tell him, take the time to do it instead of thinking having the greatest crap is just gonna make it do it itself.

And sorry if this seems like there is no point, i got side tracked and totaly forgot where i was going with it. :eh: lol