Is this Nvidia's plan for their RTX 3090 Ti/Super? Thoughts on GDDR6X

[WYP]

Could Nvidia have a faster/cheaper RTX 3090-like product in the works?



Read more about Nvidia's potential RTX 3090 Ti/Super GPU plans.

 

[Warchild]

I shudder to think what the cost would be...

 

[WYP]

I shudder to think what the cost would be...

I'm guessing the same at the current one but released next summer or September. Depends on if they need to or not. Basically, if AMD is competitive on the high-end.

 

[Warchild]

I'm guessing the same at the current one but released next summer or September. Depends on if they need to or not. Basically, if AMD is competitive on the high-end.

It has to be all down to RAM pricing

 

[Greenback]

I can't see AMD competing on the 3090 end, I'd go with there being a 3060 and a 3070 super, and maybe Nvidia keeping the big upgrades for 3090 for the 4090 instalment

 

[WYP]

I can't see AMD competing on the 3090 end, I'd go with there being a 3060 and a 3070 super, and maybe Nvidia keeping the big upgrades for 3090 for the 4090 instalment

I wouldn't count AMD as being out of the race yet. They RDNA 2 promises big gains, and 5000 series Navi was intentionally made to be small.

With the Xbox Series X seemingly delivering RTX 2080 Super performance (given already known Gears 5 settings/performance estimations from developers), I can see AMD definitely making something that can at least trade blows with the 3080. AMD can definitely do better than an Xbox Series X.

The question, in my mind, is if AMD can do better than that. Beyond that, they need an answer to DLSS. Without a competitor to DLSS, Nvidia has a key software win.

 

[NeverBackDown]

I wouldn't count AMD as being out of the race yet. They RDNA 2 promises big gains, and 5000 series Navi was intentionally made to be small.

With the Xbox Series X seemingly delivering RTX 2080 Super performance (given already known Gears 5 settings/performance estimations from developers), I can see AMD definitely making something that can at least trade blows with the 3080. AMD can definitely do better than an Xbox Series X.

The question, in my mind, is if AMD can do better than that. Beyond that, they need an answer to DLSS. Without a competitor to DLSS, Nvidia has a key software win.

They might be able to match performance but I don't think price unfortunately. Nvidia were extremely aggressive for a reason

 

[Greenback]

I wouldn't count AMD as being out of the race yet. They RDNA 2 promises big gains, and 5000 series Navi was intentionally made to be small.

With the Xbox Series X seemingly delivering RTX 2080 Super performance (given already known Gears 5 settings/performance estimations from developers), I can see AMD definitely making something that can at least trade blows with the 3080. AMD can definitely do better than an Xbox Series X.

The question, in my mind, is if AMD can do better than that. Beyond that, they need an answer to DLSS. Without a competitor to DLSS, Nvidia has a key software win.

If they had a competitor to DLSS, to get it put in games as a norm there would have to be a swing to people owning AMD GPUs, but giving the uptake of Ryzen I'd not put it past AMD, and I'd love to see them bring out a 3090 TI/super beater

 

[grec]

They might be able to match performance but I don't think price unfortunately. Nvidia were extremely aggressive for a reason

To be fair, TSMC's 7nm+ is a fair chunk denser than Samsungs "8nm"(modified 10nm), there's a chance AMD could still compete reasonably upto the 3080 given their node advantage.

 

[Dicehunter]

I can't see AMD competing on the 3090 end, I'd go with there being a 3060 and a 3070 super, and maybe Nvidia keeping the big upgrades for 3090 for the 4090 instalment

I am not expecting much from big Navi, If they can come in at 3070 performance and slightly lower priced then they'll be ok, It'll have to be priced slightly lower to offset the huge lack of software integration and features that Nvidia have with not just the new cards but going all the way back to the 1000 series, But if it's 3070 performance with 3080 pricing I can't see Radeon Technologies Group existing for much longer.

 

[Avet]

I am not expecting much from big Navi, If they can come in at 3070 performance and slightly lower priced then they'll be ok, It'll have to be priced slightly lower to offset the huge lack of software integration and features that Nvidia have with not just the new cards but going all the way back to the 1000 series, But if it's 3070 performance with 3080 pricing I can't see Radeon Technologies Group existing for much longer.

Good pont there. Radeon Technologies Group doesn't swim in money. They need to be bailed out by CPU division constantlay. The question is for how long they can function like that?

Will it be that in a couple of years we will have Green and Blue cards and no more Red?

 

[WYP]

Good pont there. Radeon Technologies Group doesn't swim in money. They need to be bailed out by CPU division constantlay. The question is for how long they can function like that?

Will it be that in a couple of years we will have Green and Blue cards and no more Red?

You say that, but it was Radeon that kept AMD running until Bulldozer arrived. It is also Radeon that kept AMD in control of the console market. Both of those are big deals for AMD.

The problem with Radeon has been AMD's budget constraints. They didn't have the money to make many new products, and that forced them to stretch product life cycles and to try and create GPUs for both the gaming and data centre markets at the same time. That changes this year with RDNA 2 and CDNA.

After bulldozer, AMD has finally had enough money to unconstrain Radeon, and a lot of console money has gone into RDNA 2's development. When Raja Koduri left AMD, he said that AMD should "stick to the roadmap". This is AMD's first big Radeon play for ages.

Today's Navi products were to tide AMD over until this point. That's why there was no big Navi and only two pieces of RDNA silicon.

Ultimately, now we will get to see Radeon when they are not in budget mode, and we will finally see what Radeon can offer after the benefit of all their work with console manufacturers since the release of the PS4/Xbox One and through the development of Xbox Series X and PS5. RDNA 2 will be a huge leap.

TBH, this is why Nvidia is being so aggressive. They need to compete with the consoles and push back against Radeon before they can bring RDNA 2 to market. Ampere is so aggressive because it needs to be.

Will AMD win? Probably not, but they should be able to give Nvidia a run for their money in traditional workloads. As far as ray tracing goes, I think Nvidia has it. Add in DLSS and Nvidia has a lot to combat AMD with. Their game integration team will just get more funding and people and that will keep their market share high. This is why I keep saying that AMD needs an answer to DLSS.

 

[AngryGoldfish]

I reckon AMD are going to come out swinging themselves. I'm shocked by Nvidia's pricing, as everyone is, and very relieved and glad, but I believe AMD were ready for it as a possibility and have competitive products to counter them. I don't think AMD will beat Nvidia. I can't imagine how anybody legitimately would. But I think they'll be competitive.

Where RDNA2 could outpace Ampere is in efficiency. AMD's 3080 competitor might only reach 250-280W with overclocks, while the 3080 with overclocks is probably going to reach 320-350W. That might mean cheaper cooling can used. I can imagine a lot of expense has gone into keeping these behemoths cool and quiet.

A genuine 3090 competitor seems unlikely, but I wouldn't be surprised if AMD can beat a 3080. We already can safely assume they can beat a 2080Ti by 20% just by doubling the core count of the 5700XT. AMD have repeatedly assured the media through various appropriate channels (so not marketing) that RDNA2 is a significant advancement over RDNA1. With the use of GDDR6X, the architectural improvements, clock speed improvements from an improved process, and a doubling of the core count, I don't see why anybody would doubt that RTG can't match or beat a 3080. AMD would almost have to not improve RDNA cores at all to not reach those levels. So IPC from RDNA1 to RDNA2 would have to stay the same for Navi 21 and whatever else they're releasing to be competitive against at least the 3080 and below.

 

[looz]

They're working around GDDR6X limitations... They've got a right banger of a GPU but for now the best density offered is 1GB per chip - and it'll double soon-ish.

 

[KingNosser]

Well one thing I know is that AMD do have something good on their hands as they put and easter egg into fortnite saying something big is coming, it was found in game and tweeted out and confirmed.

So yea AMD have something how big that something is only time will tell, but nvidia for sure can pretty easily do higher vram on 3070 3080 and maybe even more cores, otherwise if they don't need to shove more sku's in they will save them for a refresh next year.

I feel amd have something good thou they are on tsmc 7nm that alone is a plus and they are being really quiet thou i'd very much expect much more solid info this month.

 

[Excalabur50]

TBH I'd like big navi to be slightly slower than ampere, a little bit cheaper and for their raytracing to be between turing and ampere without being hot and loud, if they can do that then they'll have a real winner and competitor on their hands IMHO!

 

[AlienALX]

TBH I'd like big navi to be slightly slower than ampere, a little bit cheaper and for their raytracing to be between turing and ampere without being hot and loud, if they can do that then they'll have a real winner and competitor on their hands IMHO!

TBH the best part of the Ampere launch so far for me has been the price of it. Not because I will 100% be a buyer, but because it limits AMD on taking the pee too much.

The Vega 64 wasn't worth the asking price, and neither was the 56. They did get cheaper, but never cheap enough IMO. At least with Nvidia being paranoid they are going to have to rethink what they probably thought they could charge.

Nvidia could have got it right, and could soon resume putting their prices back to sky high. However, it could backfire and AMD could release very good cards which will keep Nvidia's prices down for at least a couple of years.

 

[WYP]

TBH, the fact that Nvidia needs to up the power consumption of this generation's graphics cards despite a process shrink says a lot.

Nvidia has been very aggressive here, and that means that they think that AMD has something. The question is will AMD follow Nvidia's lead and create larger, more power-hungry graphics cards or try to compete with Nvidia with lower TDP targets.

 

[AngryGoldfish]

TBH I'd like big navi to be slightly slower than ampere, a little bit cheaper and for their raytracing to be between turing and ampere without being hot and loud, if they can do that then they'll have a real winner and competitor on their hands IMHO!

I'm with you here. I'd rather AMD came out with something cost-effective and efficient. If RDNA2 is more efficient and cheaper to manufacture, that should be the hand AMD plays. Nvidia won't have a lot to retort to that. They'll try to sabotage it with more variety in the way of Super and Ti variants, but AMD could still have the power efficiency and price lead. Leave the RT/DLSS and outright power lead to Nvidia.

 

[Excalabur50]

I just feel sorry for anyone who ordered the new Ampere cards from the get go, as I'm pretty sure Nvidia is going to screw them over, with better card offerings.