Do I need a new CPU? (coming back to gaming)

Nine Iron

Member
I've just gone up to a 750 Ti and the improvement is very marked, but reading some of its benchmark scores online gave me pause. For reference, I'm running it at 1350/5800 - a reasonable OC - and getting roughly 1050 in Heaven (maxed out DX9), but I'm seeing pretty much double this score in other systems at the same resolution and in DX11... they have stronger CPU's.

I really want to get back into gaming - and to go up to 1080 - so bearing my spec in mind, is it worth me investing in a CPU upgrade? Afterburner tells me that my RAM is more than enough for what I'm doing - and we know how little the RAM bandwidth affects games - so I'm thinking my CPU is holding things back.

Were I to change, would it be better to shoot for higher clock (the i3 4370 has caught me eye, but it would need a board change), or more physical cores (an i5 3470, or something)? I'm on very cheap air cooling, which I would like to retain if possible; not interested in OCing whatever I would end up with.

Many thanks to any and all repliers;).
 
Look for a cheap i5 3570k, a good cheap cooler like a Raijintek Rhea Heatpipe CPU Cooler - PWM - 92mm will do the trick. That cooler kept my i5 4670k cool under load at stock and fitted find in a fractal core 1000. And was surprisingly quiet. My EVGA GTX 750 Ti SC happily runs war thunder with med settings on a 2560x1080.
 
Reading around, the concensus seems to be that a mid-high Ivy i5 would beat a top-end Haswell i3 - is this accurate, in most people's experience?

(Personally, I can't see an architecture change and 500 MHz clock bump of a Haswell i3 making the difference against the extra physical cores and cache of the Ivy i5, but this is just speculation.)
 
Reading around, the concensus seems to be that a mid-high Ivy i5 would beat a top-end Haswell i3 - is this accurate, in most people's experience?

(Personally, I can't see an architecture change and 500 MHz clock bump of a Haswell i3 making the difference against the extra physical cores and cache of the Ivy i5, but this is just speculation.)

Whats your current CPU? Yes a quad core ivy would beat a haswell i3. Its got 2 more cores and the clock speeds aren't far apart. Plus you can oc an i5 and it'll pull ahead more. Difference between ivy and haswell is power consumption first and foremost. Performance is less of an issue. Also since you don't need a new board for the ivy i5 i don't see a point in getting a new board just to put an i3 in it. Better off getting an i7 at that point to make it worthwhile.
 
im happy with my i5 2500k for gaming. anything at that performance level or better is fine.
i think your board supports a 2500k and 2600/k. i5/i7 if it does id probably opt for one of those compared to the 3xxx equivalent if price is a big difference. (i5-3470 / i7-3770/k)
if the prices are relatively the same then i would go for a 3xxx for the slight improvements on general bus speeds like usb and pcie.

but generally i would go for an i5 if gaming was my main concern. the i5 2500 even as a older generation has slightly better per core performance compared to your i3. not much in it though. i wouldnt say You NEED to upgrade your cpu. but if you wanted too upgrade your cpu then the above is what i would base my decision on. and i would probably try and get the non K versions if possible IF the price was significantly less than the K version.

p.s

after checking your boards supported cpu list. and the fact you do not wish to over clock. And neither do you want to invest in better cooling.
i would have to think that the best cpu for your needs would be either an
i7-3770S
or an
i5-3570S

both are good cpu's with reasonably low TDP and decent clock speeds. both heve better per core performance in comparicon to your i3, and have more cores.
its just a matter of which one is most attractive to you at the price, and how much you can sell your i3 for.

as a general rule "and this cannot be taken to literally its just an idea. the i5 would be about 40% better than your current i3. and the i7 would be about 60% better than your current i3."
its just up to you to figure out if that is worth the money for you.
 
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I looked up to see if the board supports ivy and it does. It's a B75 chipset which is part of the ivy line up of z77/z75/B75/H75 etc. Still should update to newest bios to be sure if you have doubts
 
i wouldnt say You NEED to upgrade your cpu. but if you wanted too upgrade your cpu then the above is what i would base my decision on.

It's just doing my head in that other systems are clobbering mine in the same tests despite the same GPU and enough (bandwidth-irrelevant) RAM... I can only think that the CPU is what's holding mine back, but any other ideas would be appreciated, especially if they're cheaper!
 
It's just doing my head in that other systems are clobbering mine in the same tests despite the same GPU and enough (bandwidth-irrelevant) RAM... I can only think that the CPU is what's holding mine back, but any other ideas would be appreciated, especially if they're cheaper!
The 750Ti is a surprising GPU, I've had it paired with the Pentium K and now the i5 4440, I've read a few articles which recommend Maxwell/Haswell pairing they seem to work well together, love to see a Maxwell/Ivy comparison just to see if there is any validity to this.
 
thats all the advice i can give sorry.
i hate to tell people definitivley one thing because in reality people have diferent expectations and values.

all i can say is IF you wanted to upgrade the cpu then PERSONALLY i would try to get an i7-3770S or a i5-3570S

the S versions should really be cheaper than the other variants of the same cpu. and they have a TDP ~65W, which does mean that you can probably get away with keeping your current cooling.
They are a definate step up from your current i3..

Something else i should mention however is bench tests arent a fair measure of gaming performance.
I prefer to run my games with something like msi afterburner + riva running.
(only works when the game is in 32bit mode)
and then watch the FPS and the cpu/gpu usage

if you do that its easy to glance at the cpu/gpu stats when FPS drop below acceptable levels, and you can see the culprate.

for instance i was playing the new thief game on a q6600 with a hd 5770 noticing some frame drops at times.
by using the above method i was able to see that at the times of the frame drops my cpu was under 100% load but my gpu was only at bout 70%

i upgraded to a fx 8120 cpu and it was the same basic story. the frame drops were still there and it was a cpu issue. "the frame drops werent quite as bad. but they were still there" (if i had gone for a 63xx or 83xx fx chip i am pretty sure the frame drops would have been gone too but the 8120 was a huge disappointment so i did not want to take a futher risk)

i then upgraded to the i5-2500k.
now when the frame drops happend it was the GPU that was under 100% load not the cpu. so i upgraded to the hd 7870.
i found this to be a very nice balance for my gaming needs and have been using it ever since.
im not saying i am 100% happy with it, but everytime i look at things to upgrade, the cost vs performance diferences does not balance out for me. at 1080p gaming "what i do" then there really is no reason for me to upgrade other than i want to upgrade. and wanting to upgrade does not warrant the cost lol.

but like i said whats good for me may not be good for any one else.
i know a few people on this forum could not bare to be using a i5-2500k and a hd 7870.
and granted if i had the money to spend. I would have a 6 core i7 and atleast 2x 980's in sli "regardless of the fact that i dont actually need them to game at 1080p"

so just have a look at your actuall gaming performance and forget about the bench tests.
but Personally.
i would be trying to get a i7-3770S or a i5-3570S for the build you have.
 
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Good shout on this.

I ran Heaven in DX9 and had the CPU usages on screen via AB, and no core went over 50%, while the GPU was getting kicked in the nuts at 99% for the entire loop.

So it seems my CPU might not be the bottleneck after all... but what else could it be? Where are these 1500+ Heaven scores coming from?
 
Good shout on this.

I ran Heaven in DX9 and had the CPU usages on screen via AB, and no core went over 50%, while the GPU was getting kicked in the nuts at 99% for the entire loop.

So it seems my CPU might not be the bottleneck after all... but what else could it be? Where are these 1500+ Heaven scores coming from?

Did you OC the GPU?
 
Did you OC the GPU?

Yes - it's at 1340/5800 ish.

Your i3 is "locked" those scores could be from overclocked i5s

Tell me about it - and my board is so bargain-bin I can't even go the other way and undervolt the i3!

If clock speed would make the difference I'd go up to a 3.8 Ghz Haswell i3; my cooler is also bargain-bin - rated to 95 W TDP, but it'd be blowing a gale by then, so OC'ing an Ivy i5 would be tricky.
 
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heaven and valley are verry gpu intensive benches and do not press the cpu much at all.

you really need to run a game with AB + riva running.
Like i said bench tests are fun and i do love to see what i can push my system too, But gaming is a different ball park to benches. they are nowhere near an accurate depiction of gaming performance.

Your title is saying that you want to know for gaming..
The closest bench i can think of for benching that will show you which component is being stressed would be fire strike combined test from 3dmark. That at least puts cpu and gpu under load. But having said that it does put the cpu under more load than most games will.

So honestly The only reall way to find out if your cpu is lacking is to fire up a game at the settings you like and watch the frames per second.
If it drops below your acceptable frame rate "mine is 60 others are 120+" then look at what is under load.
if the cpu is 100% and gpu is at 40% then the cpu cannot compute what it needs too and supply the data needed to the gpu.
If it is the other way around, or both are at 100% then you lower the AA or Shadow details/tesselesation and so on. If the frame drops still happen then its your cpu. if the frame drops stop then its most likley your gpu that cannot handle the work load.
But that does not mean the cpu will be fine with an upgraded card..

Just to try and make a point of it, bench tests really arent much more than bragging rights. to me they are just a tool to see how well i was able to tweek my system.
in the grand scheeme of things. a few thousand points more on this test does not make the game i was playing perfectly fine before tweaking any more playable.
In my expieience the benefits of overclocking is much less now than it was back in the lga 775 days.
a 50% oc on a q6600 did make a difference to the game you were playing. it actually took it from horrible frame drops up to playable.
since the 2nd gen I series lintel chips or even the x3xx amd fx chips, it really is just numbers and possibly 2-3fps

of course if you do want to bench and bench well.
you need to invest in a new board "z seriese", new cpu "K suffix" and better cooling.
 
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