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  #21  
Old 27-12-08, 10:49 PM
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Rastalovich Rastalovich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by name='nathan'
Whats wrong with that? 98% of people who think pc will say windows. Just like when you say fast food, they'll think of mcdonalds.
That's how poorly we may be educated, and frankly the ignorance is not my fault at all, but that of society and it's switch for tech for tech's sake to tech for ca$h's sake.

Pc for me has always meant personal computer, whether it be amd/via/motorola/ibm based, at which point I'd hasten to add that I run OsX/Vista/Nix on pcs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by name='SwaleSmith'
LOL On my command unleash hell......



the one problem with MACS for me is they run sweet sod all
Cept for anything u care to want on the internet. The biggest game in the world, and render some of the scenes within the image u depict, ironically.

Each OS has it's part in many choices of application. To dismiss a single one in jest over another is quite foolish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by name='nathan'
o dear, he's been in IT for years and he has 1 or 2 windows pc go wrong every day. Perhaps he should learn a little more on the network management side of things. I look after around 1000 pc's and dont get that many going wrong and i'd admit im not even a senior!
We require a support team that look after daily problems for 1000s of computers.

The matter of fact is that pcs (to which I include those running OSX/Linux) usually run fine and without incident, until a user touches them.

Too many mistakes and assumptions are made by those who feel they can use a computer based system after instruction.

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  #22  
Old 28-12-08, 10:10 AM
SwaleSmith SwaleSmith is offline
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yes they may render the scenes, but I and many others are the end user and not the programmer and for the end user who is buying a pc for games and entertainment purposes wich a large mojority do you really need a pc full stop!

And on the other side business users also a major part of Sales will require a system that is easy familier and compatible and widely supported...once again M$ delivers, (bugs or not LOL).

I have nothing against MAC's and If they was more populer it may help the PC market to grow.

There are of course many people that love them for whatever reasons they have, but theres no getting away from the fact that there is only a few...

If game developers/programers took on board MAC's then they would be worth a look, but they more than likely won't as I guess it would not be viable It seems to have been tried but they have not had any sucess, The games/app's just sit in the corner of the Apple store getting dusty :-/

To be honest M$ is and always will be largely associated with the PC, M$ market it that way (and it works) and always will do or for atleast a very long time M$ would have to screw up big time, they have a very stong footing it ain't gonna happen whilst apple has slowly expanded a little with the Mac OS it will be mainly pushed into the corner at the end user side atleast and the linux will be behind that...probably in the basemant LOL

And in any case most people would not even want to switch...they'd have to learn a comlplete new O.S and re-discover more or less everything they know and are used too, Business's would have to re-train staff at large expense, it ain't gonna happen.

Mac's will only be reserved for developers, paicient enthusiasts, people who have a have had a few bad expereinces with Windows or the people who have little idea and just say hey ''I like the looks of a MAC and Games do not intrest me, white woudl look lovely dear'' whilst there will be many other reasons apple has a loooonnnnggggg lond way to go.

Quote:
Originally Posted by name='Rastalovich'
That's how poorly we may be educated, and frankly the ignorance is not my fault at all, but that of society and it's switch for tech for tech's sake to tech for ca$h's sake.

Pc for me has always meant personal computer, whether it be amd/via/motorola/ibm based, at which point I'd hasten to add that I run OsX/Vista/Nix on pcs.

Cept for anything u care to want on the internet. The biggest game in the world, and render some of the scenes within the image u depict, ironically.

Each OS has it's part in many choices of application. To dismiss a single one in jest over another is quite foolish.

We require a support team that look after daily problems for 1000s of computers.

The matter of fact is that pcs (to which I include those running OSX/Linux) usually run fine and without incident, until a user touches them.

Too many mistakes and assumptions are made by those who feel they can use a computer based system after instruction.
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  #23  
Old 28-12-08, 10:34 AM
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Rastalovich Rastalovich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by name='SwaleSmith'
yes they may render the scenes, but I am the end user and not the programmer and for the end user who is buying a pc for games wich a large mojority do you need a pc full stop!
If u just want to play games rather than use the computer, the console is the better route.

If the 78% dominating ownership of a market is that good, why is a lesser component required to do something as simple as rendering video ?

We do it mostly cos there is less chance u can run a.. full christmas episode of doctor who.. (for example) through whatever process without the unit doing the work crashing b4 it's finished.

Quote:
Originally Posted by name='SwaleSmith'

I have nothing against MAC's There are of course many people that love them for whatever reasons they have, but theres no getting away from the fact that there is only a few...If game developers took on board MAC's then they would be worth a look, but the more than likely won't, or if they do M$ would really have had to mess something up, it aint gonna happen.
m$ have been messing up the pc as far as tech is concerned for decades and it's made the slightest of difference.

Of those who use a windows driven OS, u take a poll of those who use it cos they want to vS those who use it cos they have to.

Just cos something is there as a necessity, does not make it the best option - just the only available one. The lack of choice from previous corporate reasons that any1 under 28 or so may not appreciate, isn't a good one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by name='SwaleSmith'

And in any case most people would not even want to switch...they'd have to learn a comlplete new O.S and re-discover more or less everything they know and are used too.
That sounds like some1 who's never used a Mac. U largely turn it on and go do what u want. There is extremely little learning to do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by name='SwaleSmith'

Microsoft will always or for atleast a vey long time dominate the PC market, They will allways be associated with PC liek it or lump it!!!!
With that attitude we'll all be doomed !!

lol

"Not a human thinking"
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  #24  
Old 28-12-08, 10:45 AM
SwaleSmith SwaleSmith is offline
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rastalovich, you points are just as are mine, but time will tell M$ has indeed made a good few mess ups no doubt about it but there still here and you must remember look at how many people use it.

I have never used a mac other than having a little play in the store and they do not intrugue me to be honest, but thats just me. Thing is the world is very ignorrant and people wantto stick to what they know.

for example try telling my Dad to use a MAC....''Huh whats this do how does this work... stupid O.S Got no time for this!!!.........Crash!!!!.......in the scrap heap LOL'' this is how it is for many.
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  #25  
Old 28-12-08, 10:55 AM
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Rastalovich Rastalovich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by name='SwaleSmith'

for example try telling my Dad to use a MAC....''Huh whats this do how does this work... stupid O.S Got no time for this!!!.........Crash!!!!.......in the scrap heap LOL'' this is how it is for many.
That's an interesting opinion of a Mac.

If Apple wanted or desired to have the large market share of the pc society, as opposed to being the creme, the previous m$-esq style approach would be to buy Blizzard Entertainment and hold back on windows dev whilst pushing advancements in Mac OS.

IF World of Warcraft became THE Mac OS dependent title, the world would shift - and probably love it, as long as they similarly reduced the price of their units. Heck sell them as a package. Mini-macs don't cost much.

There really is the difference in the corporate world. If the roles of m$ & Apple were reversed, m$ would buy Blizzard and enforce non-mac developement. That was the way of the computer world.

My mom's next computer is going to be a Mac, she's 74.
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  #26  
Old 28-12-08, 12:39 PM
rrjwilson rrjwilson is offline
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This is one of the thread that I point my friends to laugh at the "PC" community's arrogance.

The fact PC standards for personal computer and therefore is all computers available to the consumer shows the arrogance and ignorance of people laughing at others for choosing a different platform. IBM compatible is suitable for all of the generalised "PC" computers as that is what they really are. IBM compatible is the architecture for the basis of all main stream use computers (ie microsoft and linux derived). It is also the reason that they run so slow compared to specifically created systems such as Apples and other independent computer systems. Apples are built on the basic C2Ds but that is where the similarity ends. Where as PCs have changed little in the way of architecture since the 386, Apple like graphics card manufacturers have exclusive building rights so the architecture of every generation's setup HAS changed to optimise its ability. Like graphics cards parallel processing is natively supported by the hardware for Apple's. This is not to say Apple havent made mistakes in architecture because they have (allowing clone companies to get hold of systems) but they were still so far ahead in ability performance was still unquestioned.

I know this will get many annoyed and so called "proof" will be banded about but the comparison between Apple's and IBM compatibles is not only pointless and impossible, it only goes to feed the flames of arrogance.

The comparison of 8800GTX compared to an i7 running the same is as close a comparison as I can get in imagery. The 8800GTX may not be the fastest but it does have massive true parallel processing power where as the i7 is yet another same old tech but with a little more kick. The 8800GTX would trounce the i7 because its like a factory building cars against 4 blokes in a shed. This is where Apple's power lies but Apple's developers are snobby and don't cross platform much and the IBM compatible world developers are snobby as well. So Optimised platform dependent software to make the best of everything will never happen.

If the IBM compatible world stopped cloning (ie XFX, eVGA, ASUS, nVidia, etc) there would only be one brand which would have the financial clout to design the system properly and ditch the frankly ancient setup for a decent setup which would then be more competitive to Apple. However, this would the cause the transfer from all to one (brand wise) and there no self build options or real modding. You cannot argue the speed of Apple but you cannot solve the problem either because we then loose our community.

I love computers from anywhere (hell I've soldered and programmed my own) because they make the dawn of a new age. But the new age has only spiralled into despair as one camp all the power and speed with no fun and the other camp has lots of fun but not enough power. To bring the age to harmony we'd need such a radical invention for processing that a complete rebuild for both sides would be necessary. Its sad really because I'd rather talk Mac with IBM community.
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  #27  
Old 28-12-08, 01:57 PM
nathan nathan is offline
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am i not correct in saying that apples are now based on ibm spec?
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  #28  
Old 28-12-08, 02:04 PM
rrjwilson rrjwilson is offline
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No they have an Intel Core 2 Duo processor in and that is all

Apple ditched that layout well over 15 years ago because it IS inefficient for process handling.
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  #29  
Old 28-12-08, 02:10 PM
nunzio nunzio is offline
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They are based on an Intel spec nowa days, that is build ontop of the older IBM spec.

As for apple ditching that layout, they never used an IBM layout, they used a motorola(ppc)/sunsystems(68k) io layout, which was better the what they was designed to do.
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  #30  
Old 28-12-08, 02:14 PM
rrjwilson rrjwilson is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by name='nunzio'
As for apple ditching that layout, they never used an IBM layout, they used a motorola(ppc)/sunsystems(68k) io layout, which was better the what they was designed to do.
Hate to say it but that is wrong. In the early days circa SE30 they had an elongated IBM spec architecture but you are right about them using Motorola chips. It was Motorola that forced them to start allowing clones to be made which caused their development to slow because it was turning to a IBM style production. Thankfully Apple canned that began restarted proper in-house development again.

Have no idea why I'm bothering to explain this because I know it will just carry on.
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