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Old 15-11-17, 08:23 PM
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AngryGoldfish AngryGoldfish is offline
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Originally Posted by AlienALX View Post
Right now we have a rough idea of what Navi is. Well, we can guess. It's multiple Polaris on one core. So right now it would be about as helpful as a wet tissue. Until they launch the tech into consoles it will be useless.
Why would they make Polaris cores when they could design a new architecture and stick those together? Other people have said Navi is going to be Polaris cores stuck together as well, but I've not seen any evidence corroborating it. Ryzen isn't Bulldozer cores stuck together. Ryzen is Ryzen cores stuck together. Navi could be Navi cores stuck together, which means that by the time Navi comes around, a GPU the same size as Polaris that costs the same to produce as Polaris will actually be significantly faster than Polaris, just like Vega 11 is likely to be faster than Polaris, just like Polaris was faster than Tahiti, and so on. Why would they use an older generation when they could develop a new small GPU (292mm˛) that's as fast as Vega 56 or even faster, and stick those two together via the Infinity Fabric. Why not even use Vega 11? We have no idea how efficient that is. This Polaris idea makes no sense to me. If I've missed some piece of evidence that explains it, fine, but from what I've seen, sticking Polaris cores together would be pointless. We already know that two Polaris cores isn't faster than the 1080Ti, and we also know that four Polaris cores won't likely be as cheap or efficient as two newer cores, so why do that?

That is where AMD are headed, and I am pretty certain Nvidia made the same noises too. We are headed into a world of dual/quad core GPUs and beyond.

So until that happens? Nvidia can lap it up in the sunshine with 5% BS like Intel did for all of those years.

Honestly pulling an Intel will only lead to more $. Why give things away when you don't need to? why not just rinse it?
Again, because AMD will take over. Intel being a much larger corporation, even they have seen how one smaller company can encroach on their market space, despite being in such a stable position. Skylake-X, Coffee Lake, we all theorise that these are both direct and indirect responses to architectures that are not actually faster. Ryzen and TR aren't faster than Skylake and Coffee Lake, but they can be produced and sold for cheaper, and without supply issues. So given that Ryzen and Threadripper aren't faster than Skylake-X or Coffee Lake, yet are clawing back market share for AMD, why would Intel bother? Because they rested on their laurels and stopped innovating and suddenly needed a big push. Surely Nvidia sees this mistake as an interested observer and knows that, even now after Ryzen has launched and is actually BEHIND Intel in performance, but is still competitive and relevant, and even after Bulldozer's failures, AMD are competitive and could challenge Intel. So imagine how Nvidia are looking at AMD now with Vega. They might not be scared of it, but they realise that if they never had a Pascal to get consumers wet over, they would be in an awkward position. So if Nvidia stops offering Pascal (the concept of Pascal), they stop being as relevant and AMD takes over, slowly but surely.

Edit as an example to that rinsing, right. We were promised Volta. We were even given a release date for Volta. Now it's Ampere. Was that mentioned before Vega came out? nope, didn't think so.

So they have already pulled an Intel.
You've jumped to conclusions there and made a rather huge assumption. You're saying that, because Ampere has been rumoured by one German site, Nvidia have redacted their 'promise' of Volta—which I don't consider a promise because Pascal was not initially 'promised', and neither do I consider it a negativism as Pascal delivered something quite excellent—and instead replaced it with Ampere, which apparently is going to be inferior to Volta just because Vega didn't wipe Pascal off the map? That is a huge assumption and a kneejerk reaction. I understand what you mean—and from what we've seen there is a slight possibility of it being true—but it makes far more sense that Ampere is Nvidia's realisation that higher clock speeds are more important than Tensor cores. Or maybe Nvidia have always planned Ampere and simply never told anyone. Or maybe Ampere doesn't exist and Volta will still come to GeForce. If it did, would you still say Nvidia are pulling an Intel? This is just one rumour, and your whole argument hinges on it being true. If it's not and Volta comes to the gaming market next year and is as powerful as it is for the compute market already, your points are completely invalidated.

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Old 15-11-17, 09:09 PM
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One reason why AMD might use Polaris cores instead of Navi cores is because they are more for gaming. Navi was built as a compute core first, and gaming second. It's more economical to use those for now.
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